This episode originally aired on Aug. 26, 2026.
The phrase, "It's a nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there," sums up some people's feelings about the “downtown” of a city.
According to a national study, city leaders' efforts to bring people back downtown have a long way to go.
The most recent Gensler City Pulse survey found that nearly 75% of city residents say their central business districts offer a great experience but fewer than half visit weekly.
This statistic applies to Columbus as well. Columbus is the fastest-growing city in the Midwest, but the survey found that the city lacks an identity.
On this hour of All Sides, we’re talking about what it takes to turn around some of those views.
How are leaders working to promote Columbus and what is the city’s identity?
Guests:
- Sheryl Schulze, managing director, Gensler Columbus
- Brian Ross, president & CEO, Experience Columbus
- Brian Kemp, real estate agent, Keller Williams
Transcript
This transcript is generated with AI. To ensure its accuracy, review the audio file.
Amy Juravich: Welcome to All Sides with Amy Juravich. St. Louis has its gateway arch, and Chicago is the windy city. Indianapolis has the Indy 500. Austin and Nashville have their music. Many cities have an easily recognizable landmark or nickname. However, mention Columbus, and you may have to indicate whether you're talking about Columbus, Ohio or Columbus, Georgia. Even though it's been hailed as the fastest growing metropolis area in the Midwest, Columbus still struggles with an identity. Defining the city as more than just the capital of the state and the home of Ohio State University. That's according to the Gensler City Pulse Report that tracks shifting attitudes, behaviors, and economic trends among city residents. And we begin our conversation today about how the recent City Pulse survey of how people view downtown Columbus. And joining us now, we have Sheryl Schulze, Managing Director of Gensler Columbus, which provides architecture design and consulting services. Welcome to All Sides Sheryl. Thanks for having me. All right. So how often does Gensler do the City Pulse survey? Is it an annual thing?
Sheryl Schulze: It's annual thing. The reason that it's annual is because markers, things change year over year, and we're tracking that data. We're tracking to see where there's improvement, where things have been tabled, and where things may be moving backwards.
Juravich: Little bit if you will. Okay, so what specific information is the survey looking to learn about cities? Maybe, I guess, tell us some of the questions you asked.
Schulze: We're asking people about how they feel, in this case, in terms of Columbus, how they're feeling about downtown, how their feeling about goods and services. Do they feel safe? Do they have connection? Do they think they have the right type of housing, education, social services? What are they missing from the equation to have a healthy, stable, productive life? And Where is the city coming to meet its residents at the moment?
Juravich: And are you asking that just of people who happen to live downtown or are you asking that of like a bigger area?
Schulze: No, in the terms of Columbus, it was citywide. And our report finds that of the respondents, 13% were living downtown. But everyone has an opinion of downtown.
Juravich: Yes, everyone has an opinion of everything, don't they? All right, so your group is an architectural design and consulting firm. So who is the information that you collect shared with? Like, is this for you, or who are you giving the information to? Or like, why do the survey, I guess?
Schulze: We do the survey because it informs our work. It informs the research that we're doing, it informs the buildings that we are building, the impacts, the experience that we were creating for the clients, the cities, the fabric of people. That we are designing for. And we use this information internally. All the offices around the globe have access to this. All the cities that have enough reporting structure to have a database of information to share. We're sharing it with people just as we're sharing it now with you, with Axios. We have a strong PR engine and we are taking this information and sharing it because it's valuable information that people can take and do things with.
Juravich: And yeah, I like that it's called the City Pulse Survey, you know, the pulse of the city, that, you know that's a good catchy thing. I'm sure that it gets picked up by media because of, even just because of the name, but tell me about what it means for a city to have a pulse. What, like, what is that? Like, what's the pulse a city?
Schulze: It's really, Amy, the way that I look at it, it's really the activation of a city. How engaged are the residents? Do they feel a sense of belonging? Do they fell connected? Is the city magnetic, meaning people are drawn to it? Is it sticky that people want to stay? As opposed to, you know, a city where, you leave home, you go to work, you go back home, you make dinner, you get up, you do it all over again. What we're finding is that today, especially after COVID, first of all, every city needs a vibrant downtown. That is essential. You need the density. Everyone is looking for a strong, urban, mixed-use environment. Everybody wants the socialization aspect, the walkability, the variety of things to do. Right now, where we see Columbus downtown struggling, is that people will come to events, they enjoy the events, but then they leave. They're not gonna say, let's go downtown for the day with really no given agenda. They're just gonna spend the day downtown. They're gonna go to a park, coffee shop. They're going to go shopping. They're doing that. They're are not doing that They're coming.
Juravich: They're coming just for if they have tickets to a show or they have tickets.
Schulze: To a concert. Exactly, and that's the challenge because when people are coming and going and you don't see the streets activated, people are like, why should I be here? So you have to give them a reason to be there. You wanna see people on the streets. It's also a safety factor too. If you don't see people in the streets, eyes on the street, people are why am I here? I have nothing to do but then go to the theater and go home. Maybe go to dinner before, but they come and they leave. And that's the thing we need to work on here.
Juravich: So you're talking about the need of Columbus to have more foot traffic, more stores, more restaurants open, you know, in the evenings on the weekends, stuff like that. Exactly.
Schulze: Columbus is 224 square miles, so is the city of Chicago, but you can walk block to block, end on end, in Chicago, and there is vibrancy all along the way. And here, there are a lot of pockets. There's a lot hardscape, not a lot landscape. We have pockets of life, though. Yeah, we have.
Juravich: Yeah, we have German village, we have the short north. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.
Schulze: Absolutely. But are all those really, would you say, walkable on foot? If you're downtown, it's a bit of a hike to go to German Village and you're walking through a lot of asphalt parking lots and areas that need to be activated.
Juravich: To get from downtown to German village, the most direct route, you have to like go over top of a highway. That's exactly right. And you look.
Schulze: And you look at cities that have landscaped over.
Juravich: Highways, right, to kind of create that connectivity. Which the short north has more so. That is correct. Yes, OK. This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking about the recent City Pulse Survey of how people view downtown Columbus with Sheryl Schulze, managing director for Gensler Columbus, which provides architecture, design, and consulting services. So as I was talking about in the introduction, cities all have identities based on a landmark or a thing they have, maybe a nickname. How important is it for a city to have a nationally recognizable landmark or even a nickname?
Schulze: That over time cities develop that not every city had that day one you look at Chicago didn't have that one a day one neither did Detroit or any other city for that matter I think because of Columbus's growth this is a unique opportunity to create that identity and that identity isn't something that's manufactured that identity is unearthed from the people that are living there the opinions the diversity of the people from other markets moving here due to the growth invested in the growth that into its own Columbus skyline will be more known in the future for other buildings and other things to look at other than currently Loveck Tower.
Juravich: So we can't give it our own nickname? Like it has to like come about organically somehow? I would say organically and if.
Schulze: And if those nicknames exist now, there's the groundswell of people, the diversity of the people that live here. You know, you may need to raise all voices. If there are nickn names, let's talk about them. I've been here for two years. I haven't heard anything yet.
Juravich: Okay. Well, you've been here. Okay. So you came from Chicago. You've been here two years. When you moved here, did you have to clarify to people? I mean, did did you say, I'm moving to Columbus or did you say I'm going to Columbus, Ohio? Like, did you have to add the qualifier? Do you know?
Schulze: No, people knew good people knew that there was no question. Yeah. Yeah, yeah
Juravich: Okay, so at least there's that. Are we getting more national recognition? If you say Columbus, immediately people know we're talking about the Ohio one and not all the others. There's a Columbus in a lot of states.
Schulze: No, there is, but no, the people that I talked to and even the people in Chicago saying that I was going to relocate here for an incredible opportunity, no, there was no question that you meant Ohio. That's right.
Juravich: All right, well, that's good. That's an improvement, I would say, over like 20 years ago when I moved here. See, we're getting there. Yeah. We're getting here. OK. Do people view Columbus as a great place to visit, but they wouldn't want to live here? I mean, like that phrase is used a lot, because I mean we're looking at your survey, 45% of the respondents who considered themselves familiar with downtown said that it's a great place to live, but that's not a great number. Like, so people who think they're familiar with downtown, like 45% of them are like, yeah, it's fine, right?
Schulze: Yeah, that's because it doesn't have the vibrancy. It doesn't have that magnetic component yet. It doesn't had that stickiness yet. That is still being developed. You look at downtown and what they're doing with the capital line, right? There's an opportunity there. You look at what Jeff Edwards is doing downtown, you know, with his mixed use developments. You look at some of the buildings that have come up under auction, office buildings, and the possibility for those buildings to be reimagined. It's all table stakes right now, and it's how we activate it, the timing that we activate. Your point of, it's a nice place to visit, but would you wanna live there? I don't think yet, and I may be throwing myself under the bus here, but I don't think people say I wanna go visit Columbus, unless there's a specific reason that they're coming here. They're coming for the university, they're come here for a convention. Or what have you, or perhaps they're visiting family. I will say the wonderful thing about Columbus that I've noticed in different markets is that people may have grown up here, may have gone elsewhere, bright lights, big city, wanting to go explore, but they're gravitating back here because it's a great place to raise a family. It's affordable. Those are the things we want to celebrate, and those are the thing that people are finding very attractive here when they are moving from other markets. Do we want be attractive?
Juravich: Tourist destination or we want to be that we want to be the livable place where people want to be. You want to be both. Oh, you want to be both
Schulze: That revenue that you get from being a destination for people coming to visit, that's incredible revenue. That revenue feeds the entire metro area. But you also want great places to live. And there are wonderful neighborhoods around here, great communities. I think what we're missing here is because Columbus is so distributed, we need more of that connective tissue between the neighborhoods. We need the transportation, the light rail, excuse me. To connect the neighborhoods to make everything viable.
Juravich: Yeah, so me saying that in your survey, you found 45% of respondents think it's a great place to live. You would want that number to be like 80, 90, 100. You want everyone to say, this is a great to live, right?
Schulze: You do, and that's the opportunity.
Juravich: And then in that same survey, 13% think downtown is affordable. Only half are satisfied with the public transit. So is that areas where we need to figure out a way to make downtown seem more affordable to everyone?
Schulze: You need affordability downtown in terms of housing for, you know, all different market shares. You need the market rate housing. You need affordable housing. You need senior housing. You need to make various price points available. I will tell you that every city on our survey, affordability comes up with every Thank you. Thank you all. Have a very good week.
Juravich: So according to the Axios Columbus article about your survey, Columbus's lack of identity did seem to be a common refrain. I mean, that was a part of the survey that people felt a certain way about Columbus because they felt like it didn't have an identity. Why do you think that is?
Schulze: I think because it's growing quickly, it's one of the fastest growing Midwest cities. It's known for the university. It's know for the state house, but that's about it until now. And you look at all the growth, you look all the work that Jobs Ohio is doing and one Columbus is doing to bring economic drivers here, whether it's in life science or aerospace or defense tech. You look at all those growing markets here and the possibility and the revenue engines that that will create. You know, will Columbus ultimately be known as a tech town to be determined? But you look at the investment and you'll see what emerges from that.
Juravich: Another survey you did showed that young adults are leaving Columbus, looking for jobs and opportunities, maybe excitement in another city, and then they come back whenever it's time to raise a family. What do you make of that?
Schulze: I think that's true. I have somebody that I worked with in Chicago, and she said, I'm going, Cheryl, I am going back to Columbus to raise my family. And I thought I'd never see her again, and look where I am. But I have found that time over time, people at other offices in the firm have reached out now that I'm here, and they're like, I've thought about moving back to Columbia. You know, I've moved to New York. I've I've moved to Dallas, but it's that. Access to family that still may be here. It's the affordability, and it's the wonderful family cultures. I have to tell you, when I first moved here, I'm like, this is like a Hallmark movie, because it was very family-oriented, very friendly people. Kids out on the street, riding their bikes, unsupervised. You know, when you're in a bright lights, big city atmosphere, like myself in Chicago, you saw those things, but not at the scale. That Columbus and the surrounding area offers.
Juravich: It's always interesting to me because affordability is a perspective, because Columbus is affordable for someone who moved from Chicago, but the survey says only 13% of people think downtown Columbus is affordable, right? So what do you make of that?
Schulze: Again, affordability comes into every aspect, and it depends. We had over 500 respondents in this survey, and that number is getting bigger year over year as we conduct this. What affordability is to one person versus another is very different. And I think where Columbus has been all along is it has been very affordable. But I think that trend of higher rents, higher cost of things, going up all over, but going up here as well. And that's the hard part people have, they can't identify with. Things must stay the same. And the true fact is that they won't. But if something is going to be. Something may cost you more, what are the things that you're going to get in addition to that that are going to make it worthwhile? Are you going to be able to walk out your front door and walk to the grocery store or the library or a drugstore or a cafe without getting in your car? What we really need to look at here are 15-minute neighborhoods, someplace that you can live and that you can walk to easily. This is a car town. We need to we need to In my opinion, we need to narrow the streets, slow the traffic down, especially downtown, so that people want to be able to sit outside and have a cup of coffee, have a glass of wine after work. And that doesn't exist right now. And that's, again, the opportunity. All solvable, we just all need to lean in.
Juravich: We've been speaking about the recent City Pulse Survey about how people view downtown Columbus. And we've been talking with Sheryl Schulze, Managing Director for Gensler Columbus, which provides architecture, design and consulting services. Thank you so much for your time today, Sheryl. My pleasure, thank you, Amy. And coming up, we're gonna talk about Columbus's identity and how people outside of the city perceive Columbus. And we're going to ask what are the people whose job it is, is to promote Columbus. That's when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Columbus has been cited as the fastest growing metropolis area in the Midwest. It has also garnered national attention in recent years as one of the nation's best cities. Despite the national attention, the latest City Pulse survey says, more work needs to be done to give the city a recognizable identity. That's where our next guest comes in. Experience Columbus is the destination marketing organization for the Columbus region. Dedicated to growing visitors, spending and enhancing how people see Columbus. Joining us now is Brian Ross, President and CEO of Experience Columbus. Welcome to All Sides, Brian.
Brian Ross: Well, thank you, Amy. Glad to be here.
Juravich: All right, so both Cleveland and Cincinnati are a little more well-known nationwide. Columbus, perhaps not so much. People seem to always need to clarify Columbus by saying Columbus, Ohio, like they're gonna confuse us with Columbus, Georgia or something like that. So based on your past surveys you've conducted, how would you say the city is perceived nationally?
Ross: Well, to answer or make a comment on your first comment, I do not like when people use the Ohio after Columbus. Me neither. I've said that before. It's just Columbus. There is no reason to identify the state with Columbus. And a lot of that is I grew up just south of Cleveland, and I worked in Cincinnati for a few years in a prior lifetime. And we're the youngest city of the three, and they've had more time. Uh, to make people aware of their destinations. And really that's what comes down with us. Um, people are not aware of Columbus the way we want them to, or they need to be. Um, once people do visit Columbus and spend time here, uh, people want to buy homes, people wanna bring their events here. People want to come back and visit, uh the many different diverse offerings we have, and I think that's the greatest thing about our community. We have not found that identity yet, and we don't want to manufacture that. It needs to come organically, but one thing that's organic that I continue in our team and quite honestly a lot of the residents I speak to, our greatest asset is our culture, and that is a culture of being a welcoming, diverse, and inclusive community. And people move here because of that, people bring meetings here because of that. A lot of development happens in the community because of that. And it's not just the culture, but because of that, you look at the diverse offerings we have. I mean, you go to German Village, you have one experience in Bronzeville, and, you know, the Near East Side and Franklin, and I can go on and on. And those are the things that really make Columbus special.
Juravich: What questions do you ask people when you survey them about Columbus? Like how do you get a better idea of what people think of when they think of Columbus? What do you as?
Ross: Well, one of the things, and we have some key questions that have been asked, but one of things we ask is, have you been here? Well, that's a good starting place. Exactly, and need to understand because that helps with the thing we do hear from people is that there's not a negative impression or perception. They just haven't been here. You know, where have you been in the past? We usually ask about our competitive cities. We ask about what they think about the competitive cities, like from a visitor standpoint, if they have family or no residents there, what are some of the key attributes that they have versus what we have and how familiar they are with some of those other cities, and then compare that to how familiar they are with Columbus. So, you know whether that's. The arts and culture, whether that's a foodie city, whatever those cities are about, we find out what a lot of the visitors and residents even to a large extent, we did this with residents how they feel about the city compared to those cities.
Juravich: And what would you say the biggest result is? I mean, do they call us a foodie city? I mean you mentioned earlier in your previous answer, you said that they talk about the culture here. Is that the answer they come up with or what do they us? A foodie City, an artsy city, yeah.
Ross: There's many things, what they do when they come here, they have an experience that is surprising to them. And it's surprising because they come here with really no expectation, because they're not aware of the community. But once they interact with the people, and again, depending what certain people's passions are, they come for different reasons. It could be to go to a performance, you know? It could be the. Whether it's visual or performing arts, or it could be going to different culinary experiences. We do have a very large, deep culinary community and we continue to try to raise that up. The fashion scene here is unbelievable. And then, even the local retail that we have in the community is unique. So, those are the things that. Once we understand what they're looking for and what they are passionate about, we help guide them in those areas, but at the same time, they discover other things and share those experiences.
Juravich: So according to the Experience Columbus website, last year the city hosted 349 conventions, trade shows, or sporting events. So is Columbus attracting more of these events? Is that a good number, 349?
Ross: It is a good number and we need to grow that. We have just in the process of doing some research and a lot of cities, when we got that 300 number, we just were able to reach that number. You know, we compete against the Indianapolises of the world, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Kansas City, but what we're seeing is we're having more of a national reputation. And we're starting to see where we're competing with the Denver's of the world, the Dallas's of the world the Austin's of the world and that goes back to when these individuals are in our community they have these experiences and see how the community again is just so welcoming uh diverse uh and and inclusive and and you can see that where you wherever you go um within the community and we've had a lot of success in hosting some very large. Influential conventions that draw national groups back to the city.
Juravich: Is there a balance between attracting tourism from people outside of Columbus? Or do you have a goal to get people to experience Columbus who live in the suburbs? You know, the Pickeringtons, the Doublins of the world, like what's the goal there?
Ross: Well, we want to have make sure everybody's aware of this tremendous community that we have and all the assets and attractions that we have. The goal from our standpoint is to educate our residents so that they can help, you know, when Aunt Lou or Uncle Tom are looking to go to different places and visit other family members. We want them to come to Columbus because of COSI, because of Park Conservatory because of you know, the short north or whatever it may be. And that's one of the important things that we try to drive traffic here. And I would say the important part from an economic impact standpoint is getting more visitors that are 50 miles or more outside of our community because they're bringing in new dollars.
Juravich: Okay, so 50 miles away. So make make a circle around. Okay. All right Correct.
Ross: So in Ohio, it's interesting when we talk about awareness. Even within Ohio, 44% of our survey respondents, when we did the perception study, were very I'm familiar with Columbus, 44%.
Juravich: You would want it to be high. Yeah, I was like, that's low. Yeah, all right.
Ross: But then when you go from, you know, inside of Columbus, I'm sorry, Ohio to 250 miles, it drops to 16%. Oh, that's not good. And then from 250 to 500 miles, it drops the 13%. And what is really keeping us from that reach is really having the resources from collaborative standpoint to get the community brand and experience and awareness. Outside of Ohio and more regionally and one day more nationally too.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We are talking about Columbus's identity and whether it needs one with Brian Ross, president and CEO of Experience Columbus. So in our previous segment, we talked with the managing director of Gensler Columbus. They provide architecture design and consulting services. The group found in a recent survey that they did that Columbus is still struggling with an identity. So. Does the city actually need an identity beyond being, I mean, we're the capital of Ohio. We're the home of Ohio State University. Is that enough?
Ross: It is not enough. I would say that those are two great feathers in our cap. But we are so much more than that. And it's interesting because we are very grateful to have Ohio State here as part of Columbus. But at the same time, there are instances when we're talking to people and they think we're a college town, not the 15th largest city in the nation. So we definitely need to have be known. For those as the capital city, also as home of Ohio State, but we also need to make sure that people are aware we have much more to offer. And as we move forward and we start to, or we continue to evolve as a community, I think you will see where a few things possibly bubble to the top organically and we can sort of say, okay, here's what we're about. Like what? I'm not sure. We have so many things. It could be fashion, it could be food, it could be overall performing, visual arts, I mean neighborhoods.
Juravich: Yeah, you said it has to develop organically, so could it take a hundred years or like, yeah, what are we talking here?
Ross: I hope not. I don't foresee that, but again, a lot of it comes with place making too. So if we understand that we have certain attributes and we need to enhance those attributes, it may mean us investing in certain areas to help support the ecosystem for us to say, you know, we're this.
Juravich: We've done a show in the past about Columbus's identity. And I guess a long time ago, we were known as the arch city because we had all these arches. We still have some of them, right? Then, you know, the short North arches, there's one, you know in old North Columbus too, but talk to me about the arch City and why it didn't stick because we tore down the arches I guess.
Ross: Honestly, I'm not, I don't have an answer to that. I haven't really heard the arch city outside of Columbus. So I guess I would say that goes back to really, you know, advancing the message as arch city and what does that mean? And what do you get when you come here? I mean, do you have only a certain area that you're experiencing the arches or, you know? It's a challenge and. Like I said, I don't know is though that has stuck
Juravich: Yeah, so no plans from you to build more arches.
Ross: No.
Juravich: Okay, got it.
Ross: But again, I do want to make sure that I share that Experience Columbus isn't the one building or providing capital development for what next is. We're playing a role in trying to provide information on what data we have that tells people whether they're a visitor, whether a resident, whether they are a business traveler, whether they are meeting professional, what they're looking for in our community. And then, you know, we have to tie that into what our community's vision is. And then I think we start to sort of percolate things and say, okay, well, maybe these three or four things are coming to the top.
Juravich: I see a lot around town with the Columbus, the U.S. Part of Columbus emphasized, you know, like made a different color, made bigger. Is that experience Columbus? Is that you guys doing that? Or is that the city? Who does that?
Ross: That was a collaborative endeavor and that was done during the Bicentennial and that was collaborative with Experience Columbus, with Columbus Partnership, with the City of Columbus, also with GCAC. Again, went through a process that was put together and the Columbus came out of it and we all leaned into.
Juravich: I really like it, yeah, I mean I love it when I see the us, it makes me smile, I think it's a good thing. Is it an identity to, like, do people outside of Columbus know that we like the us part?
Ross: People do ask about it and I would say it's like anything else and it's a logo, a brand, a lot of times those evolve and I think we're in that process now where we're seeing that evolving not that we go away from it, but there may be a way to enhance what that is because basically what it shares is that anyone can be one of us. It net goes back to the welcoming that goes back to diverse and inclusive and. And we should be a safe place for whether it's companies, whether it is individuals, entrepreneurs, whatever it is coming into our community to feel comfortable to thrive in whatever they're doing.
Juravich: That same report, the Gensler City Pulse report, tracks shifting attitudes, behaviors, economic trends among city residents. And it found that only 47% of people surveyed called downtown Columbus iconic. Do you think, does a city need to be iconic?
Ross: I think a city becomes iconic over time, and I think that we definitely have the capability of becoming an iconic city. There has to be a concerted effort, and, I know this is being talked about, one of the things that we have as a challenge downtown is our downtown core. It's a large footprint. and the connectivity between all these things becomes difficult. So there is an effort to try to figure out how to connect the different parts of downtown so that you have a seamless, you know, experience and have a seamless interaction throughout it because
Juravich: If only we had a streetcar, right? I know. But also even.
Ross: But also even walking and some of that's just the way it was built. I mean, you have Broad Street, which is basically like sort of a highway. I worked in Chicago for 10 years and it would be snowing and windy and just not pleasant outside, but people would walk up and down Michigan Avenue because there were so many things to do. And we're working towards that, But it's, you know, it's a challenge.
Juravich: Do you think the fact that Columbus has so many distinct neighborhoods is hurting the ability to build an identity because like German village is German village, short north is a short north and Clintonville is Clintonville and everyone loves their neighborhood. I feel like the neighborhoods have a stronger identity than the city.
Ross: I would say that the neighborhoods are definitely an asset, but the strength and the awareness of a downtown core is really what puts you on the map, and it helps with the vibrancy of all those other things. So I would that they're great assets and bring people in, but at the same time we to and we're fortunate we have uh, DCI and others that are really focusing on trying to, uh, or I shouldn't say trying to they are in the process of bringing more assets and creating vibrancy downtown. Um, unfortunately during COVID, a lot of people got, you know, sucked out of downtown and that energy, that vibrancia, it hasn't gotten back to where it was before and we're not unique to that, but we're trying to build back. In a different way, in an innovative way, to find and get that density and vibrancy.
Juravich: And a couple of times, I mean, I like that you said we're known for our fashion, we're known for culture, we are known for food, but how do you avoid a cliché because I feel like every city wants to be a foodie city, right?
Ross: Well, how you avoid that is to get people in here. And we have a lot of influencers that are in different areas, whether it's an influencer for fashion, LGBTQIA+, food, whatever it may be. So we've had a lot influencers come in within the food segment as a foodie city. And they've raved about what we have to offer. I mean, from food trucks to, I mean the North Market and what they're doing there, people really enjoy the, again, variety and diverse opportunities or offerings that they have. So that's bode well for us, but we need to build on that. So how do we bring in James Beard? How do we try to get Michelin? I mean all these other things, we have the foundation, but it takes, you know. Getting these individuals or these organizations in here to help, you know, make us more aware nationally.
Juravich: Does experience Columbus try to reach out to the influencers and be like, come here, we'll give you a gift card.
Ross: Well, we usually provide their stay and get them to come in, but we know what the angle is they're looking at and it has to fall in line with what we're trying to accomplish. And really what we are trying to do is the awareness and exposure of very unique, cool things that are happening. We have very, very talented individuals and in very unique spaces and niches and how do we expose that and that's what we try to do every day.
Juravich: We've been speaking with Brian Ross, president and CEO of Experience Columbus. Brian, thanks so much for joining us today.
Ross: It's been great. Thank you, Amy.
Juravich: And coming up, we're gonna get a real choice perspective on living downtown and how you sell its potential to residents. That's when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Whether it's festivals in the short north, to events on the Scioto Mile or at Columbus Commons, people are enjoying downtown. However, according to the City Pulse Survey, that enjoyment does not translate to living downtown. So how do you convince residents to move to downtown Columbus? Joining us to provide a real tourist perspective on living downtown and how you sell it to potential residents is Brian Kemp, a real estate agent for Keller Williams Capital Partners. Welcome to All Sides, Brian.
Brian Kemp: Thank you, Amy. I appreciate you having me.
Juravich: So what are some of the features and amenities that residents are looking for if they want to consider living or moving downtown? What do they want?
Kemp: Um, walkability convenience. I think the other, um, and I kind of handle two, two aspects of, of our typical relocating relocating buyer, either they're relocating from the suburbs, um maybe as empty nesters, or, uh, we also handle, I've been selling real estate for 37 years and we've handled a lot of relocation over the years. And when you have people coming in from the east and west coast, our downtown and surrounding suburbs are exciting and fun areas for people to come into. And I think the other thing that's also fun is to see how surprised they are about Columbus.
Juravich: Surprised in what way?
Kemp: Uh, pleasantly surprised in that the, um, I think a lot of times they think they may be coming to, um a cornfield and they're coming to an area where, um. You have a lot of diversity and inclusion. Um, it's a very friendly city and it's easy to get around in and for the most part affordable.
Juravich: Yeah, you mentioned that you're helping empty nesters who may wanna live downtown. Are you also helping maybe young people in the early stages of their career? Who else wants to live downtown besides empty nestars?
Kemp: Yeah, absolutely. I think the one thing that we're lacking, our son is recently graduated from CU Boulder. I think one thing we were lacking downtown is more affordable housing. Surrounding areas are that way, but he's looked at a couple of places and it's just with... Condo fees, et cetera. It's just, it's not, it's as affordable as a footer should be.
Juravich: What about families living in downtown Columbus? I mean, have you tried to sell a condo or even like a big apartment to a family who wants to live downtown?
Kemp: Uh, we have in the past we have, it's not, it' not the norm, but, um, typically with, we have some amazing private schools. So school, school, schools usually seem to be the driver, but we've had some families through the years that, uh, have decided to be downtown, um. That are going to private private schools
Juravich: And you mentioned condos, so is that what most, when you think of downtown living, I think of a condo. Is it mostly condos? Is it apartments? Are there houses that are in downtown proper?
Kemp: Um, there are a small segment of houses, uh, typically around the town street area, um, but it's, yeah, most of it is condos or apartments.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We are getting a Realtors' Perspective on living downtown and how you sell it to potential residents, and we're talking with Brian Kemp, real estate agent for Keller Williams Capital Partners. Do people have any misconceptions about living downtown? Things that you, as a real estate, especially people coming from who are not from here. Do you have to like explain downtown Columbus to them?
Kemp: Um Yes, I think there. It's the I mean, they're obviously there's different segments on the on the, on your previous segment. The gentleman Brian had mentioned the fact that it's we, we have a pretty big, I would say landmass. And so you're, you're either showing things on the north side or the south side or somewhere in between. And there's you know, there is nice diversity. You have tax abatement. Um, there's more, um, walkability in certain areas than others. Um, yet they're all, I think they're kind of fun and exciting and the amenities, uh, that are included. I think a lot of times people get a little concerned over, uh the condo fees, but when you look at what you're saving against, as far as lawn maintenance, exterior maintenance, et cetera, can still be very affordable to be downtown.
Juravich: Off mic before this show started, we were talking earlier about, I find it interesting that downtown Columbus doesn't have very many pigeons. Is that a selling point that you've ever thought of whenever you're talking to people? Think about it. Find a pigeon or two. There's only one or two, right? Yeah.
Kemp: I'll put that on my list Amy, thank you, I love it.
Juravich: Put that on your list to sell things. I mean, as Columbus gets bigger and more crowded, we will have more pigeons. That's just how pigeons work. So right now is the time, the pigeon-less city.
Kemp: Yes, absolutely.
Juravich: Okay, so let's talk about what's missing from downtown that would help attract more people to live there, for you to have more people wanting you to help them by in downtown. One thing obvious that is lacking is the public transit. Talk to me about what people say to you, you know, because there are parts of downtown that are walkable, but it takes a long time to walk from end to end. Talk to be about public transit, yeah.
Kemp: Um, public transit would be, would be extremely helpful. I've had a number of clients who've moved in, um, three of which you came in from New York city, who all had to get driver's license and cars. I mean, I had to assist them with that, which was fun.
Juravich: So they okay, so they hadn't driven in a long time and yeah hadn't known the car
Kemp: So a trolley would be nice. We were just recently in Savannah and the little hop on, hop off trolley in Savannah was spectacular. Drug stores, groceries, bodega would be a little helpful.
Juravich: Yeah, the lack of a grocery store, or if we don't have many grocery stores, just the walkable lack of CVS Walgreens, that kind of thing, there's not many of those on the corners that you see in a lot of cities. You have drug stores like at least every other block, right?
Kemp: Yeah, absolutely.
Juravich: So people are people are wanting that because if they live downtown, do they have to like, do you have to explain it? They have to get in their car and drive somewhere to get to find those things.
Kemp: The, I mean, the other plus we have and more recently is obviously the, the advent of Ubers and, uh, grocery, uh delivery services through Amazon, et cetera, have, have certainly improved that experience, but, um, I like, I'm, I'm a person who I want to go and touch my vegetables before I purchase them.
Juravich: Mm-hmm got it. So do you think from your perspective I don't expect you to have the actual numbers But just as a real estate agent from your Perspective or the number of people wanting to live downtown has it been increasing or declining in recent years?
Kemp: Um... I would say it has remained pretty flat.
Juravich: Why do you think that is?
Kemp: I think it's, it, it is a, if you're, if you're relocating from another city, it's an easier decision. If you're coming, um, for example, we, we had, we had a condo at two different condos for sale. And I saw the same three people coming from the suburbs, uh, to look at that condo, um. To, to look at both of them. They came to see one came to see the other. And checking back with those other agents, they still haven't. I think it's a harder decision if you're local to give up your, I don't want to say the convenience of your suburbs, because suburbs aren't always convenient, but the kind of giving up what you know to give up what you don't know.
Juravich: Well, and we talked in the previous segment about how Columbus neighborhoods have a strong identity where people love living in German village or the short north and they love their neighborhood. But downtown doesn't maybe have that same feel. Do you do you agree with that? When you're when you're selling to people do someone say to you I want to live in German Village and that's my that's the neighborhood I want.
Kemp: Yes, but I think they're also open to looking at other options, go explore other options.
Juravich: Do you feel, we've spent most of this show talking about whether or not Columbus has an identity, just to add your opinion and your perspective as a real estate agent, do you think Columbus, does Columbus lack an identity? Does it need one to grow and thrive?
Kemp: I do feel it does, especially with relocating people coming in from out of town when they get here, the surprise of where they're coming to, I think we could do a better job of marketing that.
Juravich: What kind of I what kind of identity do you think it is because right now we're the we're the state capital. We're the home of Ohio State University. But Brian Ross from Experience Columbus said that's not enough. So do you do you what what what would you call Columbus's identity or what do you think we're moving toward?
Kemp: I think, you know, I think Columbus is a melting pot. I think a lot of, you know, a lot people like myself came to Columbus to be at Ohio State and stuck around. And we've also, again, I'm circling back to the relocation. I mean, we've got, you know, there's just a very diverse workforce from retail to insurance to healthcare, technology. You know, there are so many venues that are bringing people in from, from all over, and I think the biggest thing people come back and they're like this, you know, they're, like, I was walking down the street and somebody I didn't know said hi to me, it's like, yeah, welcome to Columbus.
Juravich: Oh, so, okay, well, we're friendly, yes.
Kemp: We are friendly.
Juravich: Yes, and then just to end on you mentioned the affordability where there's so there's not really housing downtown for all Price ranges at the moment. Do you feel like we can do a better job with that?
Kemp: I think we could do a much better job at that. Yes.
Juravich: And is it lacking in the lower, the mid to lower range? There's plenty of expensive places. Is that what you mean? I think so, yeah. We have been talking about how to attract more residents to downtown Columbus. We've been talking with Brian Kemp, real estate agent for Keller Williams Capital Partners. Brian, thanks so much for your time today.
Kemp: Amy, thank you.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. I want to say thanks to the All Side staff, producers Marcus Charleston and Erin Esmott Rabinowitz. Student producer, Brianna Fortunat. Our student producer from Denison University is Ellen Hanson. Video production from the Ohio Channel and board operation by Chris Johnston and Trey Hayes. This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. I'm Amy Juravich.