Three months into his new job as Ohio State University’s 18th president, Ravi Bellamkonda joins All Sides for a wide-ranging interview.
In just his first few months on the job, the university agreed to a $100 million settlement with nearly all of the remaining survivors of sexual abuse at the hands of former team doctor Richard Strauss.
Ohio State also released a report which details the investigation into the circumstances that led to former President Ted Carter’s abrupt resignation in March.
Bellamkonda oversaw the commencement of more than 12,000 students in May.
We're discussing these topics and more during this hour of All Sides.
Guest:
- Ravi Bellamkonda, Ohio State University president
Transcript
This transcript is generated with AI. To ensure its accuracy, review the audio file.
Amy Juravich: Welcome to All Sides with Amy Juravich. In just a few months on the job, a lot has happened for new Ohio State University President Ravi Bellamkonda. The university agreed to a $100 million settlement with nearly all the remaining survivors of sexual abuse at the hands of former team Dr. Richard Strauss.
OSU also released a report which details the investigation into the circumstances that led to former president Ted Carter's abrupt resignation in March. Plus, Bellamkonda oversaw the commencement of more than 12,000 students.
This hour, we're going to discuss the latest news with Ohio State and look forward and discuss the future of higher education, OSU President Ravi Bellamkonda. Welcome to All Sides.
Ravi Bellamkonda: Thank you so much, Amy, it's my pleasure to be here.
Juravich: So you were on the show before to talk about AI, back when your life was probably a little more focused on OSU's AI fluency initiative, right? But now you're back and you're in charge of the whole place. That's right. Yes, how the first few months been going.
Bellamkonda: It's been amazing, really. And it's a place I know, obviously, I've been here more than a year, and then the transition happened to presidency. And what's different is that you have a view of the whole university, athletics, medicine, and also the academics. And it is just a remarkable place, and it's an honor to have this role.
Juravich: Did you have to leave the AI fluency part behind to give it to someone else?
Bellamkonda: That's right, the provost is in charge of that now, but I'm still, it's my pet project. I'm very vested in its success and it's going really well actually. It remains in my mind one of the boldest and risky because of that endeavors in higher ed in the way we embrace AI, not for its sake.
What's special about it still to me is that we really care about the things we care about, medicine, curing cancer, imagining space. Literature, for example, there's a class now on Sophocles, the Greek tragedian who writes about the "Oedipus Rex" in the series of books. And there's class on linguistics and how AI can help us better understand his writing because he's known for this idea of dramatic irony and where the audience knows what's happening but the characters don't know something.
And it's just wonderful to use AI in that context to understand. What he was trying to do and things. So the beauty of AI fluency is it's not about AI, it's really about the things we care about, including in the humanities and social sciences and medicine, and I love the imagination of Ohio State to use the best possible tools to further interrogate, understand what we're interested in. That's the special thing about it.
Juravich: Well, talking more about A.I. Fluency is probably a whole nother show, so we're going to we're going to dig into some other things, yes. So one of the biggest things to happen recently was that Ohio State University agreed to the one hundred million dollar settlement with nearly all the remaining survivors of sexual abuse at the hands of former team doctor Richard Strauss. Was that something that you as the new president wanted taken care of right away?
Bellamkonda: No, it has remained a priority for all of us at Ohio State for a long time. As I've said from my first days in my presidency, these are members of our family, the survivors. And I applaud their courage in coming forward. And it's very important to the university that we do right by them and get this behind us to the extent we can. It'll never make it all go away, but to the extend we can do the right thing.
So there's been a great desire. Across many presidencies since 2018 or so to do this. And so I just happened to be at the helm when we could bring this to a conclusion, I'm delighted. They just settled, I think, with 279 of 280 remaining survivors, and they previously settled with about 317, so it's still being worked out. I'm very grateful to the mediators who helped us get here.
But some of the details of the settlement are being worked out. But in principle, the board has ratified it, the survivors have agreed to it, and I'm hoping it will draw to a conclusion quickly.
Juravich: Did the timing have anything to do? There's a change in leadership happening with the board of trustees. Now there's a new president, even though that wasn't expected, but was it a good time to get things settled?
Bellamkonda: Not really, the judge was overseeing this process and it just happened to happen at this time. Obviously there's a great desire because if this didn't happen, we would go to trial and we were all preparing for the trial. And a trial can go where it can go and a lot of lawyer's fees and all of these things. I think both sides, and the mediator was really good. So the mediators was very helpful in avoiding a trial and coming to a settlement.
Juravich: So you settled with 279 of 280 remaining survivors, the last remaining person. Is that gonna go to trial?
Bellamkonda: We don't know yet. I can find out. I don't what's going to happen with that one case. Actually, that's a good question. I don't know.
Juravich: Okay, so it's you could you could say that one case is still in the works you have to check with your lawyers
Bellamkonda: That's right. And they may join the settlement, maybe. I'm still hoping and be part of this settlement, but I don't know what their plans are. Okay.
Juravich: Talk to me about the money. The university has made a point throughout all of these settlements to say no taxpayer money, no tuition money, no restricted donor funds have been used for these settlements. So what money is being used?
Bellamkonda: We have access to private money and other sorts of money that we don't use taxpayer money for that. Some of our endowment returns can come in there that is not restricted. So we have a general endowment. So the endowment has two parts to it that is restricted. So if you're an endowed chair, it goes to that purpose. We have unrestricted endowments that we could use those returns on and things like that.
Juravich: So okay, so that so that's where the money is coming from. I it's But isn't it all just kind of one big pot I mean when I think of Ohio State you think of like all the money, you know tuition money Taxpayer money money from here and there it all it all is one big plot
Bellamkonda: It is one big part, but it's good to keep track of which money you're using for what. It's just good practice, because some of them are restricted in the sense that it is appropriate to use this money for this purpose, and some of that is unrestricted. And the unrestricting money especially is like gold, so we use it for strategic purposes, we use for scholarships sometimes, whatever the highest priorities are.
So the unrestricting money is like, you know, is like a joker in cards, so it's very powerful. But this is a good cause to use it for. We really want to do the right thing, and we're happy to get this behind us at our best ability.
Juravich: Are you able to talk about why the one remaining person did not sign on to this agreement?
Bellamkonda: No, actually, I don't know what the details are. OK.
Juravich: And the idea of the university trying to get everything finalized, what I read was the details of the agreement are still being finalized as of June 3rd, but I hadn't seen anything after that. So are things finalized? Is money being distributed?
Bellamkonda: Not yet. I don't know exactly what that process will look like. We'll try to do it as, from our side, we'll do everything we can to expedite things. But I think there are terms of the agreement that are still being negotiated and it's confidential, apparently, the way the process works until it's finally done. So that's why I just don't know the details.
Juravich: And the university also has made commitments over the years to medical and clinical support for survivors, paying for counseling services. Will that continue or is the settlement the end of that?
Bellamkonda: I actually don't know that. I think we will continue, but I'm not sure how that works. I should know, but don't. But I can find out for you.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking about the settlement between Ohio State and 279 survivors of sexual abuse from former team Dr. Richard Strauss. And we are talking with Ohio State President Ravi Bellamkonda.
Another thing that happened fairly quickly into your tenure is that Ohio State released a report that detailed the investigation into all the circumstances that led to former president Ted Carter's abrupt resignation, which is how you ended up sitting here with me today. What was your biggest takeaway from that report?
Bellamkonda: Well the biggest takeaway is that the university has processes in place to safeguard doing the right thing and so when some attempts were made to introduce or to connect folks to resources in the university, several people at different levels stepped up and figured out what was appropriate and what was not appropriate and to me the biggest conclusion from the report was that we have unbelievable people. Who had high fidelity to doing the right thing. And so not one dollar of the university dollars was used in an inappropriate way, things like that.
Now, people's time was impacted in certain ways. But in terms of the actual financial controls and processes, I'm very proud of Ohio State and what was done there. Now, you could argue that those processes shouldn't have been tested to begin with, but they were. And that's disappointing in some ways. But that's my biggest conclusion.
Juravich: And do you feel like there needs to be any more checks and balances about power and leadership? Like after having read the report and knowing what happened with Ted Carter, are you going to institute any more check and balances?
Bellamkonda: It's always tempting to try to put in more rules. But ultimately, I don't think you can regulate your way to being a good person. I think the rules we have actually work really well. And we will obviously be open to doing that if we need to. But I think rules really worked, and that was the point of this report.
I think what we'll try to do is to think about leadership and trust and our obligations in our roles and have that conversation in the university more deeply as a point of reflection on what is the responsibilities that go with the awesome privilege of serving in leadership at various capacities, right, not just the presidency. And that's the conversation we're having within Ohio State.
Juravich: The one person who probably overstepped and didn't honor the checks and balances was former senior vice president Chris Kaborik. And he was brought here by Ted Carter. Chris Kaborik worked with Ted Carter in Nebraska. Chris Kaborik left his OSU job and took a job at West Virginia University. If he had it left on his own, would he have been fired?
Bellamkonda: It's not good for me to speculate. I'm happy he found his spot, but it was problematic. The report details behavior, and we would have acted in some way. There's no reason to speculate on what that might be. Well.
Juravich: The report cited many failures related to Kaborik saying he went far beyond any other employee in supporting Carter's efforts to help elevate Chrysanthe Velachos. Is there anyone else related to, you know, I'm sure Chris Kaborik brought in his own staff and that kind of thing. Has anyone else left the university related to this, related to Ted Carter leaving?
Bellamkonda: Not that I'm aware of. So as I said, many, many people did the right thing. More people did that right thing than didn't do the right thing. And as I've said in my opening remarks, on this issue or any other issue, we're a large, complex organization. We try very hard to have processes to have everything work as it should based on our values. But I can promise you that any time we discover anything that's not consistent with that, we will add.
And that's been my position. And so, and yeah, we would have acted with Chris Kaborik probably, but I'm not aware of any others that we needed to act on.
Juravich: Did you, did you ask anyone to leave or change jobs? Cause I'm sure you want to hire in your own team, not just to take on Carter's team.
Bellamkonda: That's a different question. The question is, we have a certain vision for the university and what we want to do, and obviously we are going to shape our leadership team to serve that mission. And I am very excited about our future, actually. You know, Ohio State, many people in the world, and I think people in Columbus and Ohio know differently, but across the country, people think of us as a, you know, athletics powerhouse, a football powerhouse.
But we really are an academic powerhouse in a healthcare perhaps too. And we have a great team, and we are going to add more members to the team to serve the vision we have for the university to go on a journey to, I think, becoming the finest public university in the country. That's our goal. And I think Ohio deserves to have a university that powers its economy, that makes excellence accessible to our students and our citizens, that informs precision agriculture and our farmers in the state. So we have a vision and I'm excited to do that work as our 18 as the Ohio State's 18th president
Juravich: One name that comes to mind is someone who Carter brought in who is former Ohio State President Gordon Gee. He came in as a consultant to help with the university's new Chase Center for civics, culture and society. Is he still doing this work.
Bellamkonda: Now, Guy's term has ended, his contract, and he has not expressed an interest in renewing it, so we haven't renewed his contract. He'll still be involved with the invest in some way. He's an emeritus president, and he visits, and I'm happy to talk to him. I have a great relationship with him. But he's no longer on contract with Ohio State.
Juravich: Oh, I thought his contract was August to August, no?
Bellamkonda: Now it's done.
Juravich: All right, was it was it done because I have the dates wrong or is it done? Because Carter left.
Bellamkonda: Well, let me rephrase. It's not being renewed. OK. So let me just, that's the more accurate description.
Juravich: Okay, so he's not it's not being renewed whatever the dates are you and I can argue about what dates I don't know what
Bellamkonda: That's it. I don't know what the dates are. I should know, but I don't
Juravich: Okay, so you're not going to keep Gordon Gee around working as a consultant.
Bellamkonda: Not through the contract. I mean, he's welcome, like any former Ohio State, and he loves Ohio State. He's welcome on our campus. He has a lot of friends here in Columbus. And so he'll continue to be engaged, I'm sure, as much as he wants to, but he's not on contract with us.
Juravich: Do you find it interesting, an interesting coincidence, maybe, that Chris Kaborik left Ohio State to go to West Virginia University where Gordon used to be the president? Is that just a coincidence?
Bellamkonda: I don't know, that would be speculation again on your part. I don't believe there's any connection there, but maybe, I don't know.
Juravich: Okay, I like a little speculation, you know? Of all the universities in all of the United States, he went where Gordon Gee used to be president. I just thought, do you find that interesting?
Bellamkonda: I don't know if they know each other, actually. I just don't, I have no reason to believe that, but I don't know.
Juravich: All right, well, we can leave that there. This is All Sides and I'm your host, Amy Juravich. We're talking this hour with Ohio State's new president, Ravi Bellamkonda. And coming up, we're going to discuss a name that goes hand in hand with Ohio State, Les Wexner. That is when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Ravi Bellamkonda came to Ohio State to be the provost and to run the university's brand new AI fluency initiative, among other things. But just a few months ago, he was catapulted from provost to president. After the abrupt resignation of Ted Carter in early March, Bellamkonda was named OSU's 18th president just a couple days later. He joins us today to talk about his first few months on the job and to look ahead to the future. President Bellamkonda, thank you so much for being here today.
Bellamkonda: I'm happy to be here. Thank you.
Juravich: So the name Wexner appears throughout campus of Ohio State University. It included, it's included in the title of OSU's Medical Center among many other buildings. There have been many protests and petitions pushing to remove the billionaire donor's name from campus buildings. The movement stems from Wexner's close ties to convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein. Now I know there were hundreds of requests to remove Wexner's name. Where do those requests stand right now?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, you're right. We have about 500 requests or so to investigate a name. I think there are three places, principally those requests are targeted towards. And we have a process well established by the board, I think in 2021 or so. They established a process for renaming generally, not for Wexner necessarily. The Thompson Library is the first one that they were requested to rename because of alleged connections to the school board and segregation and those kinds of issues.
And the same process is being used now to evaluate the requests that were submitted for renaming of Wexner. And that process is playing out. It's a faculty committee with a staff and faculty on it. It's not run by the administration. And they're very deliberate. And by design, when you're renaming things, you want it to be a thoughtful process.
So that committee is engaged with the requests. They were not designed to deal with 500 requests, honestly, so they're trying to figure out how to sort the requests into bins. And organize them so they can investigate them further. So the way the process works is the committee looks at all the things that come in. In the first stage of the process, they're only allowed to look at what the submitted materials are, and then make a recommendation to the provost about, hey, is there enough here for us to look further? And then they make a recommendations to the province. The provost then says, go ahead, look at this aspect or that aspect more, and then then after that, they make the recommendation to president.
Juravich: Where in the process are we? Have they even said anything to the provost?
Bellamkonda: So not yet on the Wexner naming. That hasn't yet gotten to the provost yet, I don't believe. But the Thompson one is much further along. So I'm expecting a report on the Thompson remain. This is the link.
Juravich: This is the name in the library.
Bellamkonda: That is correct.
Juravich: So there are requests separate from Wexner. There's been requests for years to rename the Thompson Library.
Bellamkonda: And that process is nearing conclusion, I'm told, that I should expect it in the next few weeks, a report, a very thorough report with a recommendation that I haven't seen yet.
Juravich: Okay, so you can't, I was just gonna say, what are you gonna do? Okay, you can say. So as soon as it comes out, I am happy to share, and I'm sure we'll share publicly the report and all of that stuff, so we have nothing to, the whole idea is, you know, I want it to be, in my presidency and also generally, I want us to be transparent, I want to say why we are doing what we are doing, and I'll do my best. In all these complex issues.
Juravich: But I mean, you're the OSU president and you're also a person. You have to have thought a little bit about the Wexner name and its association with Ohio State and where that stands right now. So do you think that the name should remain on all these buildings?
Bellamkonda: It's not, yes, I have personal opinions about things, but I think it's important to have a proper process to adjudicate things, right? So in my mind, obviously, I'm not immune to hearing people say what they say and have strong feelings about it, and I respect that. At the same time, I lived in Europe for a couple of years and grew up in India.
One of the beauties of this country is the individual matters and the rights of the individual matter. And we need to be fair to the process. So I don't think this is one of those things that, hey, it'd be popular to do this and why don't you do it kind of thing. That's not how decisions should be made. We should try to do the right thing. And individual matters, every individual matters. So we'll try to the right things, as I said, and be transparent about it.
Juravich: I've done several shows related to the Wexner-Epstein connection. I've heard from reporters, there's been quotes from members of Congress, who all say that without Wexner and his money, Epstein would have never existed. Wexner had the money, and Epstein may have taken advantage of him, but without Wexner money, maybe, maybe none of this would have ever happened. So is that enough at least to make you pause and think maybe Ohio State doesn't need to be tied to Wexner anymore?
Bellamkonda: Again, whatever I tell you in that reaction would be a personal opinion, and that's not relevant. We need to think these through thoughtfully with faculty input and many people's input, and we have a process to do that. The argument on one side is that they were actually duped by this gentleman, as were many, many people, by the way. And so there are arguments on both sides for this, right? So I think.
We should let the process play out and respect it. And it is a good process, and we will be transparent about the outcome of the process. But for sure, if we felt that there was no issue, we wouldn't have a process to look at things. So the whole point of the processes is to look things seriously in a considered, deliberate manner. But I will tell you that I have not seen anything right now in my time here in looking into things that makes me urgently act on the name. Uh, right, so would there have to be
Juravich: Would there have to be criminal charges or something like that?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, so whatever the standards are, there hasn't been any charges, there hasn't be any indictments, so there haven't been any of those things. And not for the lack of looking. There's been very active investigations by the FBI and news organizations and the New York Times and all these places, and I haven't seen anything that causes us to act in a precipitous manner. So I think we should look at our own process informed by our values, and we will do the right thing when the process concludes.
Juravich: Um, but you know, you can't actually set, you know the controversy with the name aside, but also Les Wexner is 88 years old. Um, he's still on the board of the medical center. Um, although he hasn't been to meetings in a long time. So do you have any influence over what happens with the medical center board and his position there?
Bellamkonda: No, indirectly, I suppose. He's a public member of our medical center board, and those are appointed by the board, the university board. And so there's no requirement for attendance for public members, actually, unlike the actual board of trustees appointed by their governor. So yes, he has not been able to attend, I supposed. But the board of trustees determine the composition of our boards, like the health center more.
Juravich: Do you know if Ohio State does end up going through this process and removing his name from anything, does Ohio State have to return any of the money he gave?
Bellamkonda: Again, we'd be speculating. We'll do what the right thing to do is when we come to decisions. They've been extraordinarily generous to the university, to your point, as have many others. And I've met both of them and have spent some time with them. And my interactions with them, they care deeply about Ohio State.
They're ambitious for Ohio State, from the arts to the medical center to other spaces, business. So we're grateful for their support. And as I said, if the process leads us do. Take actions, we will, but so far I have not seen anything to act without, you know, on that right away.
Juravich: I mean, you haven't been around for very long, so you said you have met Les Wexner and Abigail Wexner. Did you meet them at like an event? Because they don't go out in public much, so was it a one-on-one thing?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, informally I've had a chance to meet them, you know, and in all cases they've been extraordinarily gracious and given me advice as provost principally, but also I think one time as president.
Juravich: Did he call you when you got the job to congratulate you or anything?
Bellamkonda: I don't think so. I don't think he called me necessarily, but I have met him since I've become president. And my conversations with him have always centered around his passion for us being a better university. I'm literally, I'm telling you, he's got strong opinions on how we should do that. I don't agree with all of them, but I'm appreciative of his passion for us, being a a better University.
Juravich: Critics have said that having Wexner's name on the medical center, on the Center for the Arts, on that sports complex, honors him and re-traumatizes survivors of sexual abuse. Can you empathize with that sentiment a little bit?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, I'm not going to deny how people feel, and I have deep compassion for people generally, and I understand that. At the same time, we have to do right by the individuals. I mean, so what I'm saying is we have to do the right thing, and it's complex.
These issues are complex, as I said in my opening press remarks. And while I'm empathetic and compassionate to all perspectives. Our actions need to be informed by facts, by a set of principles, and in a deliberate manner. And that's the process that's playing out.
Juravich: Okay, the Thompson Library request has probably been years in the making, so are we talking like years from now before we know anything about the Wexner name?
Bellamkonda: I'm not open to speculate because I need to let the faculty decide, the committee decide how long they need. I suspect it won't be as long because in that case, they had to look into the archives and do primary research into minutes of meetings on school boards and things like this to determine what Mr. Thompson did or didn't do. In this case, we're not really set up in a committee to do the work that FBI does, right? So...
I suspect what'll happen is they'll look at the publicly available information, but I suspect that it'll hinge on the reputational harm that the guidelines provide for, you know, what the guidance should be. And the provost will really determine what the guidelines will be to the committee. So we'll see what the committee does in their first instance in the renaming requests, and we'll let it play out.
And if possible, along the way, if I can share something, we'll try to share. Because as you said, it's a long process and I don't want to be silent. For a long period of time. So if we could share something along the way, I'll definitely try my best to share with the world how things are going.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking about the Wexner name and its connection to Ohio State University, and we're talking with OSU President Ravi Bellamkonda.
OSU's Office of Compliance and Integrity released an internal investigation report just very recently related to Dr. Mark Landon. Landon made news in February because his name appears in files regarding Jeffrey Epstein released by the Justice Department. The report found no evidence to suggest that Dr. Landon was aware. Of or involved in any sexual crimes committed by Epstein or his associates. Do you have any comments you'd like to make about that report that was just released?
Bellamkonda: No, I'm just happy to know that Dr. Landon, who remains the chair of OB-GYN here, really was telling us the truth in the sense that he had no awareness, the best we can find. No victims were ever treated, you know, because he's an OB-GYN doctor, people speculate, all kinds of things, and we found no evidence. We looked through boxes before electronic medical records. There were boxes of records at some storage facility, and we really painstakingly combed through every record to see if there's any evidence of any known victim being treated here, and we have no evidence of that.
The only thing we found was that we have a general procedural thing that if you're consulting for any paid consulting, you're supposed to report it, and he didn't, and so he's going through some training and things like that to do that. It's often enough, it happens often enough unfortunately with our faculty, and we, we have standard procedure that he will go through also to report any external consulting kinds of things.
Juravich: So Landon will have to go through this training because he did not properly disclose the additional income. Under the policy back in 2001, or even the current policy now, do you think that Epstein work would have been denied if he would have asked about it?
Bellamkonda: Again, I'd be speculating because I don't know what he would say, but generally, no. Actually, our faculty are thought leaders in their spaces and they're called upon to do all sorts of different consulting, in engineering, in construction, in design of AI systems.
So we generally allow our faculty and take pride in them consulting other entities. It's part of your work. In fact, you can report it in your annual review. If you were, so. So it's not a bad thing for people to consult, and he's an expert in his own way, and he says he was consulting on some biotech startups and things like this. So without details, it's hard to say what we would or wouldn't do, but in general, consulting is not a bad thing, for our faculty. It just signals that they're sought after because of their expertise by other people.
Juravich: And Dr. Landon holds a high position within the University and the Medical Center. He remains practicing at Ohio State as a physician. He's the chair of the Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology. Do you have any concerns over the way Landon handled himself in this whole situation?
Bellamkonda: No, actually, on the contrary, everything that the report says is consistent with what he told us. We didn't find any contradictions, except for, of course, the non-reporting of the consulting agreement. So he's a very respected OB-GYN. He's a great doctor. And that's where it is.
Juravich: I mean, it's not every day that a doctor has a waiting room named after him and is, you know, that appears in your brand new big medical center tower and his name happens to be in the Epstein files. So are you a little disappointed that this all happened?
Bellamkonda: The disappointment is that, you know, we all like certain kinds of stories, and I understand our brains are piqued by interesting possibilities maybe, or not interesting possibilities, but the facts are what the facts are, you now, and he's a doctor who's served for many years. He's a great doctor. He's the chair of OB-GYN of a great department, and so we're not gonna apologize for that, right? I mean, and we need to be fair to people. Just because there's association doesn't mean there's guilt, right? So people can associate anything with anybody, right.
What disappoints me is that we have so many amazing things happening in Ohio State. And I need to figure out how we think about it. For myself, and I am a public servant in many ways, right, how do we think of Ohio State and these kinds of issues and And how do we balance that with the incredible work that's going on every day, right? Ninety-nine point nine percent of the things, there's a student going to class today and some bulb is going off in their head about chemistry or poetry or something, right.
There's discoveries being made about cancer and mental health and space and transportation. So, to me, the disappointment is that sometimes these stories take a life of their own. And they distract us, or it's not just distraction, they take time, maybe sometimes they're warranted, the inquiries, but they do take time away from and attention from the great work of the university going on all the time and the vision we have for the future. So to me, to the extent there's disappointment, it's figuring out how to balance those things, to give the empathetic to the real interest, but also to be able to talk about the future
Juravich: Well, one way is to move things faster. I mean, the Dr. Landon report came out in less than three months, right? And the report on why Ted Carter resigned, that was in just less than three months as well. So moving faster and issuing these reports kind of like puts a little closure on those two issues, Carter closure, Landon closure. So this, all this idea of Wexner's name, if it's taking so long, I mean you're going to have this hanging over you for a while, can you make the faculty committee move a little faster?
Bellamkonda: I will do my best. But remember, they're not full-time investigators. They have day jobs, and they're busy. So I just need to be mindful of their workload. But I promise you, I would like to put this behind me also. So I have zero interest in this lingering as an issue.
But at the same time, we have to be fair to the people doing it. We have to do a good job. We have be thorough. And it has to be credible when it's done. I don't want people to say, oh, the new president came and brushed it under the carpet and quickly wrapped something up. That could be a narrative, too. So I just want it to be a good process. But I promise you, I have no interest in this lingering. Right?
Juravich: Well, yeah, I feel like the idea of these two reports coming out so quickly just lends to the idea. I don't know that it would be considered sweeping it under the table. I think it would good closure for people, don't you agree?
Bellamkonda: I agree, but I think they're different, right? I mean, the renaming thing we take seriously and there are 500 requests. So.
Juravich: Most of them have to be pretty similar.
Bellamkonda: Yeah, I will look into it, because part of it is we have to decide institutionally, and I don't want to influence the process, but we have decide what we can do and what's already been done by several investigative agencies. And are we going to try to replicate what they all did, or should we focus our attention on a narrower space in terms of our faculty committee?
Juravich: Well, yeah, I'm not asking you to be the Department of Justice. No, no, no. I'm just saying.
Bellamkonda: No, no, no. I'm just saying that as a way of doing it faster, the scope of the charge given to them matters. And that's what I'm thinking aloud on. So if we define the scope narrowly enough, it could go faster. And we'll look into that.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking with the new Ohio State University President Ravi Bellamkonda, and coming up we're going to look forward at the upcoming school year and talk about the future of higher education as well. That's when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Three months into his new job as Ohio State University's 18th president, Ravi Bellamkonda joins us for a wide ranging discussion today. We've talked about the settlement with Richard Strauss survivors. We've talk about the report into why Ted Carter resigned and the future of the Wexner name on OSU's campus.
Now we're gonna talk a little bit about the students currently here in the future higher education. Still with us is OSU president, Ravi Bellamkonda. Thank you for being here today.
Bellamkonda: Thank you, Amy.
Juravich: So tuition and fees for new students increased from fall of 25 to fall of 26 by 3%. So tuition is $14,050 for incoming students who are Ohio State residents. Do you consider this an affordable education?
Bellamkonda: Well, we'd like it to be as affordable as we can make it. Just for context though, I think we're the second lowest tuition still amongst the six selective public universities in Ohio. And also when the tuition increases, we have a four year tuition guarantee program. So it doesn't increase for the students who are already here.
Juravich: That something I learned recently. I didn't know that. So if you're an in-state student, your tuition is guaranteed for the four years. So whatever.
Bellamkonda: For four years. So whatever tuition you come in at is the same tuition, so it's predictable for families, they can plan it so they're not unplanned increases, things like that. Effectively the tuition increases only about 0.94% or something from actually the money that you collect because you're only applying it to the incoming class. Now that tuition guarantee doesn't apply for out of state students or international students, but that fraction is much lower.
So if you put it in context, we're very committed to Ohio State and we have reason to to be proud of this, 70% of Ohio State students are in-state. So for context, I think Michigan, the school up north, I'm not allowed to say the name. I'm learning. That's okay, I don't mind. That percentage is like 53%, I think, is in-state. And their in-state tuition is much higher, by the way. It's 18,000 or 19,000. And Madison, I that percentage is even less than 50% is in state.
So we're very committed to being largely in-state, 70%, and to have the tuition guarantee. So We are very cognizant of access. To that end, whatever the tuition is, we're very cognizant that if there are financial need, we meet the need. We spent, I think, $542 million of financial aid last year, $16 million more than the year before in financial aid, right? So that's a lot of money on just financial aid for our undergraduate students. So 58% of our students graduate with zero debt. And that's going up by that. That percentage is going up.
So while, and at the same time, the expenses of the university are not going down. We all live with inflation. Every family feels the pinch at the gas station to construction materials. And we have a university to run and undergraduate tuition is an important part of the revenue. So our costs are going up, so the question is why do you increase tuition at all? Why can't it be free kind of thing, right? So. Typically in state institutions we're also very grateful to the legislature who supports public university through SSI and other mechanisms.
We try to cobble together money from endowment, from state support, from private donors, for scholarships, to do the best we can to meet the needs and the aspirations of building a great university at the same time being accessible. And I'll just end on saying that it's not just about access. I think that our we should be ambitious for the state of Ohio where students of Ohio who are as bright as any I have met on this campus, and I've been at a few good places, should have the access to the same excellence that you would expect at a perhaps a school in the Northeast or reputationally at least, and they do, and we're building more, right?
So when you're trying to figure out how to be accessible and have a low cost and yet build excellence which costs money in a world where inflation is increasing, This is a, we have a great finance team and they try to figure this out every year. But that's the puzzle we're trying to balance.
Juravich: We recently, WOSU Public Media, did a series called Reshaping Work where we looked at the future of work in central Ohio and beyond. And one of the things that came up was the necessity of a four-year degree. If a two-year would be just fine, do we need a four year degree at all, but in general? What are your thoughts on could some degrees be two-year degrees?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, indeed, some could be. And I'm sure there are jobs for that. But I'll tell you, I have strong feelings about the value of four-year degrees. And I strongly believe in it. And A, you look at the data about incomes with four-years degrees and not, the data is absolutely clear that the lifetime earnings with people of four year degrees far outstrips people without four-year degrees, one. Second, we're living in a rapidly changing world where, you know... The skills-based education, which is typically two-year degrees and things, are necessary and meet the needs of the moment.
But the problem with that is the world is changing so fast, so the ability to learn, to think, deal with complexity, ambiguity, which is what the basis of a four-year degree is, is very valuable, so you're adaptable in a way that you know how to learn. And those kinds of things take time. I wish we could do all that in two years, but it takes four years. That said, we're also exploring three-year degrees. The legislature's very interested in 90. Oh, yeah, let's split the difference. Three-year degree, all right.
So we are in one of our regionals and in our regional colleges will explore those options to see if there's some way to explore those. But I really believe that in a world where the nature of work is changing fast, and I won't say AI because we've talked about AI before, it is all the more important to have meta skill sets that are not just specific to knowing one programming language or one skill, because the world is changing very quickly. And in that world, for you to thrive in your fourth job, not just get your first job, you need a certain set of skills that are enabled by a four-year degree.
Juravich: What you're talking about sounds like a well-rounded liberal arts education. Indeed it is. In a funny way. Yes, but I mean Ohio State is not all liberal arts students though, yeah.
Bellamkonda: But we have a genetic requirement that actually everybody gets some critical thinking skills through a comprehensive set of genetic requirements. And I actually, funnily enough, as I'm an engineer, I'm a brain cancer scientist, I actually think that in the age of AI, the liberal arts and humanities are going to become more important and not less important.
Juravich: So you want brain scientists taking poetry classes?
Bellamkonda: I absolutely do. I truly believe. In fact, one of the initiatives we're hoping to roll out at the end of the summer is called Being Human. And I'm very excited about this initiative personally. The idea is, you know, we've always dealt with technology, but AI is sort of impersonating people in a way that no other technology did before.
And there's a famous test called Turing test, where if there's something behind the screen, can you tell if that is human or not. And until recently, we could always tell. And now we can't tell. So that's a profound change in what's happened with AI.
And what'm saying about being human is through the arts, through the humanities primarily, but through other ways, I'd like Ohio State to be the place that explores what it means to be human when you're, quote unquote, being challenged by artificial intelligence, if you will. And these are the kinds of things the university should do and lead. These are the kinds of things we're working on.
Juravich: This is All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking about all things higher education with Ohio State University President Ravi Bellamkonda. I wanted to get your take on the candidates for governor because no matter who wins the election in November, there's gonna be a change for higher education because Governor DeWine has been around for eight years. Things will change. Between Democrat Amy Acton or Republican Vivek Ramaswamy, who has the better plan for higher in Ohio?
Bellamkonda: I will just say that my politics are scarlet and gray, so I am going to work with whoever is elected and I'm sure the wisdom of the people of Ohio will play out. So that's all I can say. I'm going to engage with both of them and sensitize with both to both of them.
Juravich: Have you met either of them yet?
Bellamkonda: I have not yet. I in passing met Mr. Ramaswamy on a tennis court, but it was not a meeting meeting. So I like to play tennis and apparently he does and I happen to run into him on the court So I talked to him briefly. It was not a meeting per se But I'm looking forward to meeting them formally actually and having a substantive discussion with them about My vision for Ohio State what the issues are and ask for their support In in playing that out and also asking them how I can help or how Ohio State can help with their vision for Ohio, right? So it's a two-way conversation and I'm look forward to that
Juravich: And Ramaswamy recently said that he thinks Ohio has too many colleges, there should be a consolidation, a few should close. He wasn't talking about Ohio State, but what do you think about that?
Bellamkonda: Yeah, so we had a discussion. I'm very close to several of my fellow colleagues in Ohio State's presidencies. We have a group called IUC, and they do important work, right? But the facts of what Mr. Ramaswamy is saying is true. The demographics are declining. And so you have to ask yourself, what's the best way to use state resources when you have a declining demographics, right.
And we have immigration being curtailed. We have many things happening that point 2. How do we use taxpayer dollars? So the challenges on the other side are in many places in the state, including our regional campuses, these campuses are the anchor institutions. They have an important role in our communities. So that's a discussion that one should have thoughtfully, I think. So.
Juravich: Ramaswamy went to Harvard and Yale. Acton went to Youngstown State, Northeast Ohio Medical University, and Ohio State, where she got her master's in public health. So does she get a bonus point from you for being an OSU grad if you if your politics are scarlet and gray?
Bellamkonda: I think all the citizens of Ohio are special to me.
Juravich: No, that's how you're going to answer that? Okay, I got it. All right, well, I wanted to ask you about Ohio State's faculty because some were very excited to see you selected as president. Others felt a little left out of the loop because the decision was made behind closed doors very quickly in just a few days. Have you been able to meet with faculty groups in your past three months to build the connection there.
Bellamkonda: Indeed, actually, that's been one of the joys. I've been meeting a lot of people, a lot of faculty, a lots of staff, and talking to them. And I understand faculty who say that the process was not usual, and it wasn't, right? There's no secret there. At the same time, I have a deep commitment to supporting our faculty and what they do, and our students. We're a university because of our faculty and our student. And there's no Ohio State without the incredible faculty we have.
And no matter how they feel about me, I care deeply about all of them. Generally, they've been very respective. They've basically said, even those who had issues with the process have said, it's not personal. It has to do with how it was done rather than you. And they've be very kind to me.
Maybe it's the honeymoon period, and that'll end at some point. But I'm very grateful. Look, I mean, the... Discussion and disagreement is part of what a university does. So I don't view these as, you know, oh my god, there are people not agreeing with something or the other. No, that's what happens at a university. We have all sorts of opinions. We air them out and we discuss them and come to some conclusion, right? Or sometimes we agree to disagree. So that's all okay with me. I don't mind that some faculty are critical of something. That's their right.
Juravich: One thing that Ohio State faculty was critical and concerned about was the sweeping legislation, the sweeping higher education legislation, Senate Bill 1. Some faculty were not happy that former President Carter because he didn't publicly fight Senate Bill One. So if you were in charge then, would you have spoke up against the bill?
Bellamkonda: Yes, I think there is actually, President Carter, myself, we care deeply about the academic mission of the university. Now. There are some within our community who feel like we should stand up and make statements and do that. And the challenge we have is, what is the most effective way to have change happen or to have influence in whatever the processes you're trying to influence? Sometimes it is making public statements and taking stances. Sometimes it's giving room for those who are trying to do something to understand it and do it privately.
I can tell you that in every instance, The university is actively engaged with the legislature, with the federal government in research and education, in policies that are being made. We are never passive with this. We're always actively interested in seeking our time, arguing our case. Sometimes it's better to do it publicly, sometimes it's a better to it privately. And that's a judgment call we make.
Juravich: Unfortunately, we have less than a minute left. What's your number one priority heading into the fall semester in August? Is it this being human thing you mentioned?
Bellamkonda: No, we have several things going on. My number one priority is to have a culture of... I tell the campus, let us give ourselves the gift of high expectations. The gift of higher expectations because our mission demands it, our research mission and our mission of education.
And so my number one is to try to create an environment and a culture of reaching for the stars. Because I think the state of Ohio deserves an exceptional public university that is also accessible. My pursuit of excellence is not for it to be elite, but to have the conviction that we have to have access to excellence in large state universities. So I'm excited about that.
Juravich: We've been talking with Ohio State University President Ravi Bellamkonda. Thank you for your time today.
Bellamkonda: Thank you, Amy, I've enjoyed it very much.
Juravich: This has been All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. I'm Amy Juravich. Thanks for joining us.