We’ve all heard the buzzwords: AI, automation, and hybrid.
But behind the tech are the people who will actually drive our world forward.
Join us for Untangled from All Sides as we look past the headlines to ask: Are we actually ready for the workers of tomorrow?
From the classroom to the boardroom, we’re mapping out the skills, the shifts and the mindset needed to thrive in a world that hasn't even been built yet.
Is there such a thing as a 'future-proof' workforce? We’re talking about how we prepare today’s students for jobs that don't exist yet and how we ensure no one gets left behind.
Guests:
- Scot McLemore, vice president for talent strategy, Columbus State Community College
- Lisa Gray, president, Ohio Excels
- Matt Damschroder, director, Ohio Department of Job and Family Services
Transcript
This transcript is generated with AI. To ensure its accuracy, review the audio file.
Amy Juravich: Welcome to Untangled from All Sides and double WOSU public media. I'm your host Amy Juravich. Across the country and here in central Ohio, work is changing fast, creating new opportunities and real questions for workers, families and employers navigating a complex moment.
This is Untangled, a show where we take a complicated topic and untangle it for you. We explain it in a way that makes it easier to understand. And this season, we are tackling work. We've all heard the buzzwords. AI, automation, hybrid. But behind the tech are the people who will actually drive our world forward.
From the classroom to the boardroom, what are the skills, the shifts, and the mindsets needed to thrive in a world that hasn't even been built yet? Are we actually ready for the workers of tomorrow? Joining us to try to answer these questions, we have Scot McLemore, Vice President for Talent Strategy at Columbus State Community College. Welcome to All Sides, Scot.
Scot McLemore: Thanks, Amy. Glad to be here.
Juravich: And Lisa Gray, president of Ohio Excels, which is a nonprofit that connects business leaders to education with a goal of improving outcomes for every student. Welcome, Lisa. Thanks for having me. So Scot, let's start with you with that big question I asked. How do we plan for the workers of tomorrow? Like, can we predict the future?
McLemore: Well, at Columbus State, we're really focused on connecting with our industry partners and understanding well what their current needs are, but to your question, what their future needs are. So we've invited and assembled a workforce advisory committee as an example with the talent leads from many of the larger and larger employers within central Ohio and have asked them that question.
And they've really rolled up their sleeves and helped us understand what their talent needs are and where things are going in the future, everything from healthcare to IT to advanced manufacturing. And we asked them that question about trends and what they're seeing, and we make sure that what they are telling us, we incorporate in our activities within our curriculum, as well as our non-credit programming that we offer at the college as well.
So I think even though it's dynamic, of course, much of it still remains the same in terms of fundamental skills and competencies that we're hearing from employers overall. But we're making sure that those changes that we do see from technology or the influence of AI we're incorporating as best we can into our curriculum and programming.
Juravich: Lisa, what are you hearing from educators about what their students are asking for? I mean, do students know what the future in the workforce will look like for them?
Lisa Gray: Great question. Some of them do, but most do not. And so there's a lot of work to be done, not just working with students, but with their families, our K-12 educators, in particular, I think, in higher ed at Columbus State and Ohio State and other colleges and universities in the area.
There's more of a deliberate connection to the workforce. We're working hard at OhioXLs to try to make stronger workforce connections for students across the board and start earlier. We actually are Looking at how do we do more of this work in middle school?
So kids know what their options are know what they're interest and aptitudes are and then have a better idea going into high school The course taking whether or not that is, you know a traditional high school course taking, whether that's a career pathway or going into a career technical education center, we need to do more.
Juravich: We know some middle schoolers. Can middle schooler know what they want to be when they grow up well enough?
Gray: So it's funny, because somebody asked me one time if we were going to start this in kindergarten. And I said no, because if we expected a kid to choose in kindergarten, my son would be Batman today. So you know, we have. Mine would be the world's greatest soccer player. There you go.
So you do they know exactly what they want to do? No, but we can help them think about it. So when we talk about career interests, what are the things that you're good at? What are the things that you like to do? What kind of jobs and careers are aligned with that? Where are your aptitudes? What are you good at?
I think one of the things around career connected learning and career pathways that people make a lot of assumptions about is that a kid is gonna make a choice and they're stuck with that choice. Sometimes it's just as important that a student knows what they don't wanna do. As it is to know what they want to do.
We hear stories all the time about young people, you know, going on to post-secondary who started in a degree path and say, I had no idea what this was. I don't like this. And so then they're starting over. So this is really around career awareness and exposure at a younger age.
Juravich: So Scot, your job description says that you align education with industry demands, particularly in manufacturing and technology, which you were explaining before, but give me an example of a program that may have started at Columbus State that is in line with industry demand. So you talked to people and then you said, this is what we need.
McLemore: Yeah, I can give you two examples. One is in the biotech space or life sciences. So a member of my team, Michelle Ward, coordinated an opportunity where she brought together industry representatives for life sciences here and members from Amgen, Andelin, a few different gene therapy and life science companies. To ask them specific questions about knowledge, skills, and abilities.
So we're building on a brand new program as Life Sciences is new to central Ohio. And we wanted to make sure that we were offering an opportunity for central Ohioans to get into these careers, either through credit bearing program or through non-credit boot camp, if you will. So they provided us with those knowledge, skills, and abilities.
And then what Michelle and the team at Columbus State did is created a biotech boot camp which focuses on good manufacturing practices, which is essential in life sciences. So you have to go through processes in a way that focus on quality, not non-contamination, you're documenting things well. And those were things that we had not done at Columbus State in terms of particular programming before the entry of life sciences and these companies coming here to central Ohio.
So then. We work with the faculty and we work with instructors to build out this programming both on the credit side Through our biosciences as well as the non credit side in terms of that programming and we stand up You know a 120 hour boot camp where adults Could change careers by learning and and sitting through this with instructors from the field and then they get hired on to Andaline forged biologics HICMA, et cetera. And then we work with Amgen to build out an apprenticeship program that then allows them to continue and get a degree from the college as well.
Juravich: This is Untangled From All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. And this show is a part of the WOSU Public Media Project called "Inside Reshaping Work." We are talking with Scot McLemore, Vice President of Talent Strategy at Columbus State Community College, and Lisa Gray, President of Ohio Excels, which is a nonprofit that connects business leaders with education.
Lisa, tell me about what you're seeing with students when they leave high school, because you have polling that shows that. 43% of Ohio students, so that is about 138,000 kids, did not go on to more education after high school. So what does that mean for their career prospects? A number like that.
Gray: Well, I think what it means is that we have way too many kids that are not prepared with the knowledge and skills to start and keep a career that pays the family a sustaining wage. And so when we look at the changing demographics of the workforce and we know what employers are looking for, while it may not necessarily be a four-year degree or a two-year degree, it is something beyond high school, a traditional high school diploma.
So whether or not that's a career pathway in a specific industry, earning a recognized credential, or a 2- or 4-year-degree, we know that students, the majority of students, are going to need something beyond High School. And right now... That is not the case. And so it's part of the reason that we're so interested in beginning these conversations earlier with students and families about what it takes for a student to earn the kind of living wage.
You know, when we talk with them about what kind of car do you want? What kind of house do you what? You know do you wanna family? And we can begin to show them that. A simple, traditional high school diploma while super important and absolutely the starting point is not going to be enough.
Juravich: Scot, you used to work at Honda, so can you tell me about how that experience has helped you in this job with Columbus State? Basically, did working at Honda teach you how to predict the future here?
McLemore: Well, it informed what manufacturing operations look like, what it means to progress through the company. I worked with operators and associates at Honda that were working the production floor that later became plant managers, for example.
And as an entry-level engineer, and then my ability to work through five different divisions in the company and have all of these different roles, some in engineering, and then manager of our technical talent team and then our talent acquisition team just showed me the wide opportunities that are there within manufacturing and how you can start from many different places and if you're a continuous learner, you know, you can take on that next opportunity and just continue to grow whether you're supervisor or whether you grow your technical talents.
It's really a matter of your ability to apply that knowledge. And network really well. And I did learn a little bit about technical training while I was there and how it's done on the manufacturing side. What I didn't know before going to the college is what post-secondary education looks like, and then connecting those two things.
So my experience with Columbus State while I was with Honda did allow me to understand how industry and the public sector, in this case the college, can work together to create a flexible apprenticeship program. We have a program now called "Modern Manufacturing Work-Study Program," and students after their second semester can work at a company, a manufacturer, three days a week while earning a salary as a student technician, and then continue their coursework two days a day at the college and complete their degree.
Juravich: I interviewed Steve Stivers from the Ohio Chamber of Commerce recently, and he said that the days of doing the same job for 30 or 40 years are over, and that we all need to be continuously learning to succeed in the future. Do you both agree with that? Lisa, do you want to start? Yeah.
Gray: Absolutely. We actually worked with the state on an AI task force in education, and in speaking with the employers about the changing world of work and the way that technology and AI is disrupting the work, not necessarily removing jobs but changing them, You know, everybody's going to have to be. Willing to learn new skills, new technology, and so part of what we're trying to do in these conversations about work-based learning is also talk about team building, creativity, innovation, lifelong learning, that you're not gonna be in the same job doing the same thing the way your parents and your grandparents might have.
Juravich: Yeah, Scot, you kind of like alluded to that where the continuous learning, so you talked about at Columbus State, you're not, you don't just have 19 year olds who are coming out of high school coming to take classes from you, right? I mean, you have all ages, tell me about that.
McLemore: Yeah, so at Columbus State, it's a very diverse population of students from every way that you can think. And we're really wanting to make sure that every single student is successful. And we do that by making sure that they're aware, to Lisa's point, about all of the different opportunities that exist and different on and off ramps that they can take to get to these great careers.
We have a classroom. Learning, of course, but one of the powerful learning opportunities at Columbus State and really most community colleges that applied learning, that happens. And so we're wanting to make sure that students can can apply what they learn in in a lecture, but then also take it to the next step and meet with employers to understand specifically what they're looking for in those skills. And if possible, provide them with a work-based learning opportunity, either as an internship or some type of exposure to that industry directly.
Juravich: When you say applied learning, you mean taking what you learned in the classroom and then actually doing it?
McLemore: Yeah, that's right. And in that, as an example, in the "Modern Manufacturing Work-Study Program" or our "IT Flex Apprenticeship Program," students are learning, hands-on learning and applied learning in the classroom. And then they're gonna work as a student in those operations. And they're going to have to solve problems.
They're gonna have to help get equipment running again. They'll have to learn how to implement new equipment with other technicians and engineers and operators within that. And that forces them to apply that learning that they've had at Columbus State directly in those operations at that industry.
Juravich: And Lisa just mentioned that she's trying to teach students to learn how to use AI rather than seeing AI as something that's gonna take a job away from them. Can you give me an example of that maybe with Honda? Because when you think of automation, you think about the auto industry, right?
Where these machines are building parts of the cars that humans used to build a long time ago, but then there's humans there who need to run the machines and fix the machines and understand the machines. So tell me about, give me an example of what you're teaching and then you're sending people to Honda that know what they need to know.
McLemore: Yeah, so what we found in not just Honda, but you know, most of the technician roles across central Ohio, 80% of the skills are the same. And those are fundamental skills around electrical, pneumatic, hydraulic, mechanical systems, and electronic systems.
Columbus State begins teaching those fundamentals on simple. Concepts with individual components, if you will, individual pneumatic components, individual hydraulic components, because most of the equipment that's being used, whether you're brewing beer within Heiser-Busch, or whether you are building cars, the equipment really works very much the same in many ways. You're building product and then you have to convey it from one location to the next.
So we're teaching students those fundamentals. And then as they advance, we're having them put it together in an understanding system, so how pneumatics and hydraulics and electrical fundamentals and those components work together to create a cell, if you will. And then when they go on to work at a Honda or Worthington Enterprises, they're tasked with understanding how a system works in those operations. And then they get the opportunity to troubleshoot when there's a failure or there's a breakdown. On that production floor and those technicians, those student technicians are working directly to analyze that problem and then get the product or get the equipment up and running so that they can continue to build product.
Juravich: This is Untangled "Reshaping Work" on 89.7 NPR News. Coming up we're going to talk more about predicting the future of work and we'll also talk more about integrating this future into middle school and high school classrooms. That's when Untangled from All Sides continues on 89 7 NPR news.
You're listening to All Sides.
Amy Juravich: You're listening to Untangled from All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Untangled is a show where we take a complicated topic and untangle it for you. Explain it in a way that's easier to understand. This season, we are tackling work.
They say the best way to predict the future is to create it. But that's easy said than done when the rules of work are changing every single day. We're talking about how to prepare today's students for jobs that might not even exist yet and how we ensure that no one gets left behind.
With us in the studio, we have Lisa Gray, President of Ohio Excels, which is a nonprofit that connects business leaders to education with a goal of improving outcomes for every student. Thanks for being here, Lisa. Thank you. And also with us, we've got Scot McLemore, Vice President for Talent Strategy at Columbus State Community College. Thanks again for being her, Scot. Thanks, happy to hear.
And I said in the introduction, the best way to predict the future is to create it. So Scot, what is Columbus State doing to help guide its students to be leaders in the future of work? What are you telling them about what they need to do?
McLemore: Yeah, well, it's an interesting question because some of it is really, again, focusing on the fundamentals, right? Those 21st century skills or human skills, as I like to call it, and being able to be critical thinkers, being able to communicate well, and be able to read, quite frankly, because when you talk about AI, for example, one is only as with that as they're able to understand.
Both the prompts that they put in, for example, and the information that's coming out. So I think that critical and analytic thinking is as important now as it ever will be. And, you know, staying abreast of what's happening in industry, we have an opportunity for students to engage in what we're calling the future technician learning community.
So every student within our technology programs, we're getting them connected with industry. And they are communicating with industry directly through our LinkedIn private page that we have set up. And then our employer engagement opportunities, the employers are coming directly into the classroom and hearing from industry partners on what they're looking for and what's gonna happen in the future.
Juravich: Lisa, similar question to you but related to high school students. Can high school students create their own path at a young age when they already have so many requirements in high school? I mean, they have to take certain classes. Is there enough room in the high school curriculum for them to learn about this future, this job of the future?
Gray: There is enough room, but that said, I think there are things that we can do to transform or change some of the things that we're offering in our high schools. It's been a long time since we've taken a look at that, and it's probably time for Ohio to do that.
Other states are doing that, but it's also part of the reason that we want to begin having these conversations with students and families at a younger age. If we can begin doing some of this career awareness and career exposure earlier. In the middle school, we can work with kids on their interest in their aptitudes and do some of this prep work before they go into high school.
It allows them to really think about what are they going to do with their four years while they're in high school? What's their course taking going to look like? Are they interested in being in a career pathway or an industry-focused pathway? Might they wanna leave their traditional high school and go to a career tech center and What are the opportunities around work-based learning and internships?
And so there are a lot of conversations that are happening. There's a lot more that need to continue to happen to make that a reality for students in Ohio. We have a bill, Senate Bill 328. It's really around middle school career readiness and making sure that all students in Ohio have an opportunity to have these conversations in middle school. This is happening in a lot of schools, but we need to scale it and make sure that it's happening for all students.
Juravich: Yes. So a few months ago, you released a statement in support of the Senate bill. It's in front of lawmakers right now, but it's still in committee. And the bill would create more career connected learning opportunities. That's what it's called. Correct. But I guess I would ask, how are schools going to implement this without hiring extra guidance counselors or career focused teachers or something like that? Like, how is every middle school going to start teaching about careers if they're not already doing it? Thank you.
Gray: For asking that question, so I'm happy to answer it. So I think we can all admit that we ask our schools to do a lot. And so the question is, are we gonna ask them to do more? What we know is that about 70% of parents want more of this kind of career-connected learning for their students.
That is polled pretty consistently in Ohio. But we also don't have to just lay it on the plates of our... Middle school educators. They can have partnerships with their career technical planning districts, which is an organizational element of the state. They can do this with their career technical partners, high schools, where they have some of the high school teachers that come down into the middle school.
But we also have a lot of opportunity for public-private partnerships. Just here in Columbus, You know, just to name a few, we have I Know I Can, we have Junior Achievement, we the Past Foundation. Battelle is doing a ton of work in the STEM space. You know we have Tech Corps.
We have all kinds of these community programs and we need to do a better job of knitting all of this together. And saying this is a community focus. Columbus State is doing lot of work. With K-12 partners. They have a whole division that is working with local schools.
So we often hear these kinds of goals for schools and districts, and the assumption is it has to be those classroom teachers or those school counselors. And the fact of the matter is sometimes it's better to have these public-private partnerships come in and be the ones working with the schools to get this done.
Juravich: So you basically listed off a whole bunch of organizations that you say can work with these middle schools. And so instead of the teachers who are there, the guidance counselors having to do extra, you bring in these partners. But I mean, logistically, that sounds like a logistical nightmare to try to like coordinate people coming in on certain days of the week to all the middle schools, will that be lined out in the bill or will Will lawmakers provide funding to hire an administrator for all the schools to like coordinate bringing these people in?
Gray: Well, first of all, most of the schools are doing things like this already. So all of the groups I just mentioned are working with schools right now. So this is not something that's new to a middle school that they would have partners in some way.
You know, on the funding side of it, we do have in the budget career awareness and exposure dollars. We need more of those. And so that'll be something that we'll be advocating for in the next budget. You know, and so... Again, working with these partners, it doesn't necessarily have to fall on the shoulders of the schools.
Many of these partners are funded to do exactly the things that we're talking about. And so we've been really careful in the bill not to have a one size fits all approach. If you're a district that feels like you've got the capacity to do this yourself, great. You've got teachers that can do it. You have partnerships with your local career center. Great, do it yourself.
If you're not, and it's something that you think that your kids would benefit from having a community partner that comes in and does this, great, do that. So we're not... The bill is not prescriptive in how it gets done. Scot, you've been doing a lot of nodding.
Juravich: So where does Columbus State land on all this, on the idea of this career-connected learning from middle school and high school level?
McLemore: Well, I can give a specific example of what Lisa was talking about in terms of the public-private partnerships that are happening already. So as part of the collaboration with Intel, for example, and the funds that they provided to build our curriculum and the funding that they provided to state educators, we partnered to build out an online career exploration tool that focuses for middle school students to learn more about.
Biosciences, semiconductor careers, clean energy careers, and focusing on technology. And that is, we partnered with the Ohio Manufacturers Association to host that site on their Making Ohio website. So any, really anyone can access, if they went to that site, they could access this gamified career exploration tool to not only learn about the technology behind these careers, but what some of these companies that are here in Ohio are doing, and then they can learn what educator in their location across the state would provide them a pathway to get to those careers.
Like she said, we're already working on those things with our partners and trying to do more of that with our K-12 partners here in central Ohio and quite frankly across the state.
Gray: And we're seeing a lot more of that from industry across the state. So, you know, business leaders are really leaning in in a different way than they used to in terms of internships, work-based learning, pushing into the classroom and having conversations with students.
How do we better prepare teacher doing teacher externships, bringing teachers into places of business so that they can see the kinds of connections and they can make those connections when they're teaching math and science and social studies and English language arts. And so, you know, it's really how do we bring everybody in the community to address this, you, know, this challenge that every community has.
McLemore: I forgot to mention, it's Chip City Adventures. Chip City adventures is the name of the game that's on the Making Ohio website, makingohio.
Juravich: Or I think it's okay. So like students can go and play this game and go play the game.
McLemore: They can go play the game and learn. Yeah, there are five different modules, a general manufacturing module, and then there's semiconductor, clean energy, biotech, and I'm forgetting the fifth one, something in technology, yes. Yeah.
Juravich: Yeah. Okay. So and this is a way and they could this is something you're hoping maybe some schools will incorporate in their curriculum. Exactly. Yes.
McLemore: Exactly, yeah. So there are pre and post assessments that instructors can do. We want to make it easy for teachers as possible. And I think if I could add to what Lisa's saying, Lisa and I were part of a convening here on Friday at Columbus State called the central Ohio Compact.
And it's an opportunity for central Ohio educators to get together with industry members and the college to talk about pathways and everything that Lisa's talking about in this bill. And I think the more that we can create that line of sight, not just for students, but for those teachers in middle school and high school about what these industry opportunities are, the better off we're gonna be.
And we need to continue to do much more of that at the table that I sat at on Friday. There was a discussion around having instructors, having teachers in high school and middle school understand not only what those opportunities are but how plentiful they are in central Ohio, because they just don't know. They're driving by these companies every day and not knowing what exists in terms of those opportunities.
Juravich: This is Untangled from All Sides, and I'm your host, Amy Juravich. And this show is a part of WOSU Public Media's project "Inside Reshaping Work." We're talking with Lisa Gray, President of Ohio Excels, and Scot McLemore, Vice President of Talent Strategy at Columbus State Community College.
Lisa, I feel like we're putting a lot on high school guidance counselors to know what kind of jobs are out there as well. And I'm sure a lot of them have spent years, if not decades, telling kids to go to college. Right? So how do we change that mindset if a guidance counselor's training was all just, you need to go to college? So we still, let me be clear.
Gray: We still need kids to go to college. But everybody doesn't have to go to college, and I would say the pendulum probably swung too far, and the message was every kid has to go college. What we know, as I said earlier, is that every kid needs something after high school.
That could be military, that could be a credential, two-year, four-year professional degree. It's a conversation to have with our guidance counselors, but it's also a conversation that teachers in the classroom should be having with kids. It's conversation that parents should be having with the kids.
This is not a conversation that just should fall on the shoulders of our educators. You know, there are ways that we can promote these kinds of opportunities. It's why we want businesses to come into the schools. Earlier so that they can begin those conversations.
So kids are not just having to rely on a guidance counselor, a school counselor, you know, our ratios in Ohio are one student to like 450 or 450, yeah, to one counselor. And so it's gonna take more than just a guidance counselor to be able to do this.
It's why we believe we need to start earlier. We've got to get the message out to parents. I think, you know, for a long time, people believe that if their child didn't go on to a four-year college, that, you, know, their student wasn't a success. That is not true. We have way too many kids that are going on and not finishing.
And so if they go to college, it's really important. It's not just about access. It's about completion. So you know again, it is going to take public-private partnerships. It's going to take parents leaning in in this space, teachers, counselors. Coaches, you know, the people that are part of the clubs at school, oftentimes kids are more likely to listen to their coaches than they are to their teachers or their parents. And so how do we sort of bring everybody into this conversation? Before we run out of time,
Juravich: Of time because we are just about out of time. I wanted to lean back into that idea that it's not just the 18 and 19 year old that we need to upskill and find these jobs, but also the, you know, the older worker needs to go back and get some more training.
And in looking things up for the show, I found a lot of things about the state's tech cred program. So it's a program that gives employers a chance to upscale current and future employees in this tech-infused economy. Employers can submit successful applicants will be reimbursed $2,000 per credential. Scot can really quickly, can you tell me about upskilling older workers, I guess?
McLemore: Yeah, from the Columbus State perspective, we think it's a great opportunity for individuals. And if they're already employed and they're an operator at a company and they want to become a technician, for example, we have programming to do that.
And we find a lot of success in those. And then the company gets funding to pay for those costs. We're very excited about WorkforcePAL. I don't know what that is. And so there's new legislation around from the federal government around paying for short-term credentials and that that will change the game for individuals that may not be employed in a particular industry area that they want to continue.
But they can change those opportunities through funding through the federal government to allow them to obtain that short- term credential and pivot from whatever they are into some greater economic mobility opportunity.
Juravich: Well, unfortunately we're out of time. I feel like we could have talked about this for a lot longer, but we have been talking about planning for the careers of tomorrow with Scot McLemore, Vice President for Talent Strategy at Columbus State Community College. Thanks for joining us.
McLemore: Thanks, Amy.
Juravich: And we've also been talking with Lisa Gray, president of Ohio Excels, which is a nonprofit that connects business leaders to education. Thank you for being here, Lisa. Thanks for having me.
And coming up, we're gonna talk about what the state of Ohio is doing to prepare for the workers of tomorrow. That's when Untangled From All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
You're listening to All Sides.
Amy Juravich: You're listening to Untangled from All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Untangled is a show where we take a complicated topic and untangle it for you. Explain it in a way that's easier to understand. This season, we are tackling work.
A strategic plan that looks at the workers of tomorrow will probably ensure the right people are in the right positions at the right time. But how do you plan for tomorrow when technology is changing so rapidly? From AI to automation, There are lots of concerns about what the future will look like and how we prepare for it.
To discuss some of the ways the state of Ohio is looking ahead and planning for the workers of tomorrow, we have Matt Damschroder, director of the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services. Welcome to All Sides, Matt.
Matt Damschroder: Thanks very much.
Juravich: So the last few times we've talked to you, it's been about the family service as part of your job, right? So I wanna talk about the other half of your title. That's the job part. When you think about how Ohio is positioned for the future of work, what comes to mind for you?
Damschroder: Well, I would say there's two things that come to mind. One is that we're doing great. And there's all kinds of things that are going on in Ohio from an economic standpoint And I think the other part that comes in mind is ready for the future And so I think you know as Governor DeWine talks about Ohio being a great place to live and raise a family and have a career all of the things line up here for the future economically and from a labor perspective
Juravich: So the governor's office of workforce transformation is working on what it calls its top jobs list, which you could also probably call an in-demand jobs list just from me looking at it. So when I looked at it, the top job with the most demand didn't have anything to do with AI.
It was home health and personal care aides. So this is the place with the job openings, but it doesn't pay well. The median salary was $31,000. Why are we have such a need for home health and personal care aides? Why is this the top job?
Damschroder: Well, not too surprisingly, health care as a sector is one of the biggest industries, not only in Ohio, but also around the country. And as individuals continue to age, as we continue to have new and exciting technologies and medicines, all of those things just create more and more demand for jobs in that sector. So there's always going to be growth and opportunities in health care.
Juravich: Well, and I was seeing from your spreadsheet, it shows there are 16,000 openings for home health aids. I mean, that's a lot.
Damschroder: Yeah, it's absolutely a lot. And again, when you look at the entire the entire sector, there's all kinds of opportunities available. And I think it's important to think about when we when we do these things. It's also just like there's lots of jobs available.
It was also a whole spectrum of skills from things that are easy to get into with limited training like phlebotomy to something that requires, you know, a four or two or four year degree or even advanced training. So lots of opportunities in Ohio in that space.
Juravich: So with lots of opportunities, I mean, 16,000 openings, but unfortunately the median salary I said is $31,000, how do we fill these positions? How do we pay more? How do make these jobs more attractive?
Damschroder: Well, I think one of the things that we do, particularly for young people, is with our pre-apprenticeship program to give them an opportunity to kind of experience, kind of test before you drive, a career opportunity, and see if it's something that's right for them.
And so there's lots of ways to do that, but for us, with our registered pre-aprenticeships program, that's really a great way, especially for young to do it. For folks in other places in their career pathways, There's lots of opportunities through the Ohio means job centers to get training and those kinds of things to to get into a career.
And I think one of the great things about health care in particular is even if a person comes in at a at a lower skilled position and they're at kind of that median wage, there's all kinds of opportunities to progress up through a career in healthcare. So even if you come in at an entry level, there's lots of opportunities to progress within the system.
Juravich: Another top job on your website was truck drivers, more than 10,000 openings, median salary higher, $58,000. Tell me about the need for more truck drivers.
Damschroder: Yeah, transportation and logistics is a growing thing, I think, whether it's traditional bricks and mortar retail or things that come to your house multiple times a day. Or just the moving of things around the country, there's lots of opportunities in that space.
And so, you know, there's also for folks, you know who want the opportunity to be self-employed, trucking is a great opportunity. The other thing that's for Ohio in that space is with our energy sector, particularly in Eastern Ohio, there's lot of need for folks to drive.
You know gas and all the types of things are needed for energy production around the state And so it's not just goods that are being transported It's a lot of the other materials that go into the manufacturing of goods across the space
Juravich: The future of AI, understanding new technologies, coding, all these jobs get all of the buzz, all the attention. I feel like that AI is everything and it gets all the media attention. But what Ohio needs is home health aides and truck drivers. I mean, am I oversimplifying that?
Damschroder: Well, I think one of the things that we try to do with the in-demand jobs list is to show that there's, you know, it's not just those things that are on the news every hour as kind of the future. It's really the full list of the labor force, that there is something really for everybody.
And I think that's one of important messages, both with Apprenticeship Week and with In-Demand jobs week is to say. You know, you have the opportunity here in Ohio to have a great career and create a great life for yourself. And it's not just AI, there's lots of other things.
There's manufacturing in ways that we didn't think about before. There's skilled trades, there is education, there's medicine, healthcare and all those things. And so really getting people to look at all of the things that are available to them right here in the Ohio is part of the focus of what we do within Demand Jobs Week.
Juravich: Yeah, so the in-demand jobs also showed 3000 openings for software developers, and that had a median salary of whopping $108,000. I mean, that's great. So when you look at this list of in- demand jobs and the needs for the future, are there state dollars out there to help with recruitment? How do you, you know, you can make this pretty spreadsheet and have this website and call it in-Demand jobs week, but how do you Tell people about it.
Damschroder: Yeah, so we appreciate you highlighting it here at WOSU. And so part of what we do with the in-demand jobs list is this kind of gives the guide to our regional workforce boards around the state for when somebody comes into their local Ohio means job center or accesses ohiamisjobs.com and can access funding for additional skills and training.
We use this as kind of the guide of this is where we want folks to invest. Those federal and state dollars, workforce dollars, into these types of jobs first before they do something else. And so when somebody goes into their Jaime's Job Center and have a conversation with an employment professional or someone else, they're gonna be looking through these kind of things and say, what might be a good fit both for you for what you do, what you have done, and what your existing skills base is.
Juravich: This is Untangled from All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. And this show is a part of WOSU Public Media's project "Inside Reshaping Work." We're talking with Matt Damschroder, Director of the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services.
Something I came across in researching for this show was what Ohio is calling Apprenticeship Week. You already mentioned it. So you're trying to turn the spotlight on Ohio's apprenticeship program. Tell me what are these apprenticeships and how do you find one?
Damschroder: Apprenticeships are a great opportunity for anyone to learn while they earn in any career. And so one of the things that we're trying to especially spotlight around apprenticeships is that, you know, when people think about apprenticeships, often they think about the skilled trades.
And certainly here in Columbus, IBEW over in Goodale, the Carpenters and Millwrights So over on the West side have great facilities that are training lots of folks. For those skilled trades not just for now but for the future. But there's really opportunities in any sector for an apprenticeship program.
And so whether it's manufacturing, whether it is healthcare, all of those types of things have apprenticeship opportunities. In fact the most recent one that we just finished registering in the Youngstown area is around drone piloting. And so there's all kinds of opportunities for apprenticeships. And really Ohio is a leader in this space and has been for a number of years. We have the third most apprenticeships in the country, the number one in the Midwest. And so there's over about 25,000 Ohioans currently enrolled in one of over 200 occupations with an apprenticeship in Ohio.
Juravich: So an apprenticeship as opposed to an internship, an internship would be for a student who's either in high school or college, who's still learning, but an apprenticeship is for someone and they're learning on the job and they are earning money, correct?
Damschroder: That's right. And the apprenticeship program is a formalized approach to that. So in order to be a registered apprenticeship, an employer, group of employers, or a labor union has to follow some certain federal and state requirements around safety, minimum number of hours, making sure there's an adequate amount of both in-classroom training and on-the-job hands-on training in to be registered.
One of the benefits of that registration is it's transferable and recognized in other states as well. And so with that formalized process, you're getting a certificate essentially that says you are capable of doing this set of skills no matter where you're at.
Juravich: And I was looking at your apprenticeship dashboard that you have on your website. It looks like most of them are in construction. There were 26,000 active apprenticeships. 18,000 of them were in construction with 7,000, of those being electricians. I mean, is there any way to connect apprenticeships to those in-demand jobs we were just talking about? Can you have an apprenticeship for a home health worker or a truck driver?
Damschroder: You can, and a lot of our employers and employer groups are starting to turn to this formal apprenticeship program as a way to both recruit individuals into their workforce and also kind of create a career pipeline for them.
One of the things that we find is individuals who are participating in a formalized apprenticeship program have a much higher rate of retention. With their employer. And so that's one of the many things that my employers are looking at this. You know, I think one of these, you know, Ohio is a manufacturing hub and a lot of the great things that we have coming in the future, whether it's Andrel down in Pickway County, semiconductors, all of those kinds of things from a manufacturing standpoint, a lot employers are are looking to how do we come together with the Ohio Manufacturing Association and others to create these formalized processes.
So that folks can get into manufacturing and not view it as this dirty, unsafe thing of maybe years ago, but really have apprenticeship be a pipeline for those very important and in-demand jobs.
Juravich: And your dashboard, I mean, is very open, right? So it showed the 26,000 active apprenticeships and it showed that only 7% were women and 16.7% were people of color. So that makes me think that the state has done, needs to do more work in letting everyone know about these apprenticeships. I mean why so few women? Is that because most of them are in construction?
Damschroder: Well, I think some of those things are definitely legacy components of apprenticeships being primarily in the past, a skilled trades type of thing. And I think all of the skilled trades, both union and non-union, have done a good job in recent years of reaching out both to women and to people of color to join their unions, to join their trades.
And so I think that's growing and it'll take time, but that is continuing to grow. And so, I think really, you know, as we look at with pre-apprenticeships and that approach, getting into high schools, middle schools, colleges, making sure that people understand that an apprenticeship is a great way to get into an important job, a job that you can have a great career and raise a family, that it's for everybody. And so those are some of the things that we do as a state agency. Is to promote that to everyone.
Juravich: Are you looking to expand the apprenticeships? I mean, you said that Ohio has one of the most active and biggest programs. I mean what are you looking to expand it to, what other, do you want more companies involved?
Damschroder: We want two things. We want more people to sign up to become apprentices, and then we want to find more employers who will create apprenticeships. Again, I think employers have kind of thought of this as a skilled trades thing in the past, but really anything, any type of work can be apprenticeable.
I was down in southern Ohio last year and with some of their high schools and their workforce boards created an apprenticeship program for the local car dealer for folks to come into the mechanic program. And so, anything that really any employer does has a potential for an apprenticeship component.
Juravich: And does the state of Ohio help the employers with any of the money or is the employer paying for the apprenticeship?
Damschroder: So the employer is paying for the apprenticeship. We'll help them complete all the paperwork that's necessary in order to become registered with us and the US Department of Labor. Give them all the guidelines around the minimum number of hours for the in-class, minimum number of hours for the hands-on.
In cases where the type of work may not line up exactly with the minimum number of hour requirements, we can work with them to submit a waiver that's competency based. So that those industry credentials are achieved through the training program, but really we want to work with employers to help them Create opportunities to build apprenticeships here in Ohio so more people can become involved
Juravich: We've been talking about in-demand jobs and apprenticeships in Ohio with Matt Damschroder, the Director of the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services. Thanks for your time today. You got it, my pleasure. And this is Untangled reshaping work from all sides in WOSU.
Be sure to subscribe to the Untangled podcast so you don't miss an episode. Next time, we're gonna talk about the role of the immigrant workforce in Ohio. For Untangled and All Sides, I'm Amy Juravich.