Spring has officially sprung and now it’s time to spruce up our gardens and beautify our spaces with flowers, vegetables, plants and trees.
Ohio's Garden Sage Deb Knapke is back with expert advice on what to plant and when.
Guest:
- Deb Knapke, Ohio’s Garden Sage
Support WOSU 89.7 NPR News during our spring membership drive and you can receive a ticket to WOSU's "Drinks and Dirt" event on May 5 as a thank you gift.
Transcript
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Amy Juravich: Welcome to All Sides with Amy Juravich. This is our spring membership drive. More about that in just a moment.
Gardeners are probably familiar with what's being called yo-yo weather or whiplash weather, a non-scientific term that conveys when conditions are all over the place like they've been lately. Temperatures soaring to 80 degrees one day and plummeting to 40 degrees the next. These kinds of extremes, from frost advisories to downpours to gusty winds.
Can wreak havoc on our best laid gardening plans. That's why we've called on Ohio's garden sage, Deb Knapke. She's here to help navigate these weather challenges with us and more.
And not only will she be giving her usual stellar advice today on All Sides, but on May 5th, back by popular demand, is our Drinks and Dirt evening event with Deb. It'll be Tuesday, May 5, and it's going to be here at the WOSU headquarters. More on that in a minute, but first I have to say, Deb, welcome back to All Sides.
Deb Knapke: So nice to be here. Let's start with the wacky weather. I mean, in a span of a few days, it was 80 degrees one day. We followed by a frost advisory like a day and a half later. How do plants experience such extremes? Like, how do they react?
So it depends on the plants now if you're looking at a lot of our native plants they're used to they've evolved with these changing conditions even though our yo-yo seems to be taking bigger swings and they deal with it for the most part you'll see daffodils and then their little flowers bend over and then they come back up that's not a native plant but where they come from they're used to weather extremes so
Some of our plants deal with it just fine, but if you are in cautious enough to put your tomatoes out too early, those might be toast.
Juravich: Yeah, my tulips in my backyard were not very pleased at all. No, but my neighbor's tulips, which face a different direction, they were fine, right? And they look beautiful now. And I was just I was jealous because I was like, oh, my two lips got it.
Knapke: So many of our discussions now are on climate adaptable gardens and plants. How can we choose those plants that are going to make it through crazy stuff?
Juravich: We also saw three to six inches of rain across the state between March 31st and April 4th. And in some places that is actually more rain than we got in all of March, right? So how does that contribute? Like, what does that do to the soil, that much rain in just like a week?
Knapke: It's definitely squishy. My backyard, I had standing water for a couple of days. Not as much as I've had for some rains, but now we're looking at almost every year, having a hundred year rain, which... Well, then we can't call it that anymore.
Juravich: No, we can, and I'm going to leave that up to Erin Wilson to work that one out. Who's that? That's it?
Knapke: Erin is the Ohio's climatologist, extension.
Juravich: Oh, yeah, I've talked to him before. Yeah, he can name he can give it a new name
Knapke: He can give it a new name. I don't know what to call it anymore, crazy weather. But a lot of the soil, if it becomes waterlogged, we can see plant crowns and plant roots rotting if it's there for a long period of time, especially if it is more than 48 hours.
You're going to see plant death and you're going see some trees react adversely. But for the most part, if the water goes down... Within 24 hours to 48. Say that cautiously. They'll be okay.
What we need to make sure is that we have our soil draining well. And if you have low spots, then put plants in there that will take that kind of condition. So now we're working on what do we plant and where.
Juravich: Alright, we'll get to that in a second. But first, this is our membership drive. Remember, listener support is the most important part of our budget. Make your gift right now at wosu.org or give us a call 866-897-9678.
Ohio's Garden Sage Deb Knapke is joining us for an evening of drinks and dirt with WOSU Public Media. On May 5th, we will celebrate Cinco de Mayo with a Southwest theme. Stencil your own terracotta pot. Enjoy refreshments. And take part in a live Q&A.
And then create a succulent planter to take home. The planter will feature plants from Groovy Plants Ranch. And it's all happening from six to eight at WOSU. So start a sustaining gift at $13 a month right now, or make a one-time gift of $156.
Make that gift at wosu.org to secure your ticket. And your gift, and getting that ticket, supports public radio. If you listen to All Sides every day, we're asking you to support the programs you value. You listen to this station because you know that you're going to hear news that you can trust.
So we're asking you to make a gift of support and make this drive a success and support public media. Starting WOSU Public Media each month is a way to stay informed, connected, and stay with our communities. So this is a strong choice to keep us strong and independent.
Start a monthly sustaining gift today. And again, that is $13 a month to get a ticket to drinks and dirt. 866-897-9678 or wosu.org. All right, Deb. So back to what you were saying. Plants that can handle the wet, the rain.
Knapke: We do have plants that like more water. One that comes to mind if you have some room is Joe pie wheat, one of our native plants. Loves that moisture. When you see it along the roadsides, it's in the ditch where the water collects.
Ferns, now that's a shade plant. And so if it's the shade that you're getting a lot of water, that's something to be aware of. What you don't want to put are plants that want really well-draining soil like thyme and sedum.
You know, those plants that like it hot and dry. So they need to be up the hill. But if you have those lower places, look for plants that say, okay, I can take the moisture.
Juravich: And what about the times, you know, a few weeks ago when we had really significant wind gusts? I mean, there was damage, there were downed trees and limbs everywhere. How do you pick a sturdy plant that can, like, withstand the winds? That is a hea-
Knapke: huge discussion right now looking at trees and all those pear trees that are out there, those are weak-limbed and so we're seeing a lot of breakage in that. But you want to look for trees that have that good crotch angle and I know people can't see me, but if you put your hands together and make an L, you want that wider crotch-angle, not a V.
Look for plants that will be able to withstand more winds, but I will say, when we get 60 an hour, 60 mile an hour gusts, I don't care what kind of crap you know it has. If the wind comes just right and there are leaves on the tree, it's going to catch that limb and break it off. I was amazed at seeing some trees broken off mid-tree trunk.
Juravich: Well, and the winds were like, it was windy for like a long time. It wasn't just a couple of hours, yeah. And we lost po-
Knapke: Yeah, we lost power for two to almost two days. No, not quite. I want to say 36 hours
Juravich: Okay, yeah, yeah different parts of the city definitely lost power so and some of that was probably to the fault of tree limbs falling
Knapke: Well, I know on Olin Tangi River Road and Linworth Road, we had downed trees across the road. They had to close Linworth road. You couldn't go down it until they had fixed it. So yeah, just keep your fingers crossed.
Juravich: Yeah, you mentioned climate and how the 100-year rain is happening every single year. How does climate change make someone like you rethink what you planned? Have you been thinking about that a lot more in the past couple of years? I have. In fact, I've been thinking about it since...
Knapke: The late 90s. Oh, you're ahead of your time. Just because I was already seeing differences in my own garden. I was seeing the changes in the seasonal creep, if you will, earlier spring, longer fall, winters where we're putting on shorts for Christmas.
Speaker 4: You know, like that.
Knapke: And I grew up in Lake County, up by the lake in Ohio. So you're not afraid of snow? Not afraid of the snow, and we would wear leggings to school for all of you who are in the same age or age as me.
But it's so different up there. My stepmom is up there, and I talk to her all the time about the weather. And it is so different, up in lake county. And I've noticed those same changes here, because when I came here to school. It was a certain way.
And now I have been here long enough that this is home and I see my home changing.
Juravich: Do you keep, I mean, maybe your brain can just remember everything, or do you keep a journal of everything that happens so that, so when you say something like, in the 90s, blah blah blah happened, like, do you, do have that all written down?
Knapke: It all written down. I go through fits and starts. Some years I'm really good about writing everything down. Other years it's like, well gee, I haven't been here for a month. But I do like to do monthly summaries and I like to note different birds who've visited or not visited.
That has changed in our yard. I also like to look at the plants that have died and why. Was it my or was it something else? So I keep track of that. And the weather is something that I notice all the time, especially rain.
Juravich: Do you keep Jack of it just in your own yard, or some of the public gardens you work with too? Do you have a separate journal for this place, that place?
Knapke: It's not separate, it's all rolled into one. It's my observations, me sitting down and thinking about what's happening. So for a while I did keep a separate journal for the Heritage Garden because I was learning the plants, the native plants of Ohio.
Juravich: Tell our listeners where the Heritage Garden is.
Knapke: Thank you. The Heritage Garden is a garden that represents the different regions of Ohio and it's at the Ohio governor's residence. And it has been in existence since, I want to say 2002, 2003.
And it is open for tours on Wednesdays, so if you're interested, please take a look at it. But when I was first starting there there were a lot of those native plants I didn't know I mean, everyone knows the usual, but there's the unusual at the Heritage Garden.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. We're talking about gardening with Deb Knapke today, and this is our membership drive. We hope you can join us for our upcoming Drinks and Dirt event.
Spend an evening getting your hands a little dirty. Deb Knapke is joining us for Drinks & Dirt at WOSU Public Media. You'll stencil a terracotta pot and enjoy a Southwest-inspired Cinco de Mayo atmosphere. You will build your own succulent planter to take home.
It is May 5th. From 6 to 8 p.m. And it'll be right here at the WOSU headquarters. Secure your ticket right now. Start a monthly gift of $13 a month or make a one-time gift of 156 dollars to get your ticket. Do that right now at wosu.org.
I want to say thanks to Deb Knapke for her help with the class and thanks to Groovy Plants Ranch for their help with the plants. Public Radio is for the lifelong learner. It's for people who chase curiosity. Do you learn something new every time you listen to NPR and WOSU?
Well, we're taking that learning piece to the next level and offering a hands-on class that will be both fun and educational. You will be attending the class with a great group of fellow public radio supporters. So make a gift now, secure your ticket, and support public radio at the same time.
And I should add that this class will include refreshments that compliment our Southwest theme. Secure your seat right now, don't wait. Visit wosu.org. And you will be supporting shows like All Sides. We count on listeners like you to give during these drives.
And in return, we bring you news and information that you trust. All Sides is here every morning at 10, talking about what's going on in central Ohio. We have in-depth, thoughtful conversations. And we can do that because we're listener-supported. That's you.
Join us for this event. Give now at wosu.org. I wanna say thanks to Janice Whittle from Bataskala. Thanks for your support and getting things going this hour. Join Janice, join us for this class.
Again, Drinks and Dirt is May 5th. Don't miss your chance to get a seat. 866-897-9678 or wosu.org. Deb, for our Cinco de Mayo themed event, can you give listeners an idea of what to expect? So we'll be demonstrating how to make a succulent like planter to go. Succulents are pretty popular, right? They have always been.
Knapke: With me. They are one of my favorite plant groups. I have way too many of them in my own greenhouse. So succulents are from arid, drier places and they take low care. In fact most people kill them with kindness by over watering them.
Juravich: Say they don't want all your water. They don't WANT your water!
Knapke: And we will be, the succulents, we have many succulence that we're getting from Groovy Plants Ranch. And may I mention that I'm working at Groovy plants ranch now? Oh yeah, yay. I'm there on the weekends, so it's a ball. It's just, it's incredible.
Juravich: It's incredible. They're a great place. Great friend of the station too, yeah.
Knapke: So these are minis, and we'll be putting a bunch of minis in there, and you'll be seeing Haworthias, for those of you who know the names, and Echeverias, and Sedums, and oh gosh, I'm trying to remember all the ones that were in the trays, but there's just a wide variety of trays.
We'll be planting them, we'll making a mess on the floor, probably. We're okay with that. Maybe don't tell our events team, but we'll, yeah, keep it a secret.
Speaker 4: So.
Knapke: And then we'll be talking about plants, your yards, questions you have. Bring your questions. We'll, as you said, we'll be doing a Q&A.
Juravich: Yeah, I will ask the questions. I won't have the answers because my thumb is the furthest whatever the opposite of green that's my thumb but um the uh but the succulents you'll you'll try to um hammer it home about how much watering they actually need are we talking like a little like a spritz bottle or like what kind of like watering do you recommend
Knapke: So when my succulents are outside in the summer, I let Mother Nature take over, but I don't take them out until most of the spring rains are done. Otherwise, they'll rot in the pots.
In my greenhouse, I water them once a week or once every two weeks, depending on how much sun comes into the greenhouse. In the house, I have succulence and they get watered once every... Week to two weeks again depending on how big the pot is and how much soil there is.
Juravich: Do you just know if it's one week or two week by looking at it or you know, is it all It's all vibes. It's vibes.
Knapke: I put my finger in the pot or I'll lift the pot and I'll say, oh, this is dry, it needs to be watered. But fortunately, most of the succulents can go bone dry. You want them to be dry, you want a light pot.
So I tell people, water, pick up the pot, feel how it feels. And when you pick it up and it feels really light, it's time to water.
Juravich: We did a Tech Tuesday segment not too long ago where our regular tech guide, Russell Holly, was talking about this thermometer thing that you stick in the soil and it'll tell you whether the plant needs water or not. Do you like those? Do those work? It is.
Knapke: A water it's sensitive to water and there's a little depending on what type it is we have some at Groovy Plants Ranch that a it senses the water and there's some type of fabric in there that when it is filled with water I'm probably doing this the opposite way it is And when it needs water, it turns blue, the fabric in there.
So it somehow sensitizes. Or it's the opposite. Sorry, folks.
Juravich: Whatever it is, when it turns the color, it needs the water. That's right.
Knapke: Yeah. And I used them in the past when I was first learning, back in college. I did use some of those hygrometers, as I think that's what they're called. But now I just sort of look at the plant.
Some plants are very vocal about it. They look like they're parched. Yes, very droopy, very wrinkly. But our succulents often don't give us the same clues. Although the Haworthias will start turning kind of a reddish.
Juravich: That says water me. You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. This is our membership drive and that means it's time for you to support the in depth conversations that we produce every day. You're only going to find this news and information on public radio.
Give now a wosu.org and this is a very special time to become a member because this hour only we are talking about our great thank you gift. Get a ticket to drinks and dirt. Here's what your evening will look like.
First, you're gonna stencil your own terracotta pot in a Southwest style, and then you're going to enjoy a Q&A with Deb Knapke. And then to wrap it up, we will create a succulent planter to take home, featuring plants from Groovy Plants Ranch.
It's Drinks and Dirt on May 5th, right here at WOSU Public Media. Start a sustaining gift at $13 a month, or make a one-time gift of $156 at wosu.org. This class is exclusive just for WOSU members.
You can only get a ticket by becoming a member right now. This class gonna be so much fun, so don't wait to get your ticket. Don't wait, we have a limited number of seats. So don't miss your chance.
And we want to say that if you have been a sustaining member for a while, it may be like $10 a month, you could increase your gift right now to $13 a month and you can pick up a ticket to drinks and dirt as your thank you gift. And those extra dollars every month.
Are going to help support public radio in the future. It's truly a win-win. Remember that your gift is essential to the future of this station. You will be supporting thoughtful, in-depth discussions that keep you informed and entertained.
And it's no secret that public media funding has changed recently. We no longer receive federal funding, but guess what? We're still here, thanks to listener support. Listeners have always been the most important part of our budget, and WOSU will continue to meet its mission every day.
Thanks to listeners like you. So support the station now and get a fun thank you gift in the form of a ticket to drinks and dirt. Give now before we run out of tickets if you want to attend this workshop. Go to wosu.org right now or give us a call 866-897-9678.
Thank you to Patricia Hultz from Worthington. And Patricia wrote us a note saying, I'm so grateful that WOSU and NPR is continuing despite the loss of federal funds. Well, thank you, Patricia. We are continuing. Thanks to people like you making a gift.
We're still here, as I said. And then thanks to Clinton Brown from Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts. So I don't know whether Clinton's coming to the class or not, but I love that. And he also wrote keep the honest news and keep it uplifting when possible.
All right, Clinton, we'll do our best to keep it uplifting. But thank you for joining us. Join us for the class wosu.org 866-897-9678. I mentioned there about stenciling the terracotta pot with Southwest, is it Talavera style? Am I saying that right? Well, some people may.
Knapke: If they're really artistic, yes, it would be. But it's fun, they're plastic stencils and will have all kinds of paints and colors, the turquoise, yellow, orange, red, those bright colors that you see on the Talaferra pots, which I own a few and I plant them every year because they're that bright spot in the garden with annuals that do not put your annuals out yet. I just thought I'd put that out there.
Juravich: All right, so when should we put the annuals out? Please wait until...
Knapke: Until right before Mother's Day or after Mother's day.
Juravich: I knew you were gonna say Mother's Day, yeah. Although we are, I cheat every year, I have to admit. I get my pots done usually at the end of April and then if it gets cold I have to go outside and put sheets over them. But that's on me. So just know that if you cannot wait you will be going out and putting sheets over your pots if we get cold.
Juravich: So second weekend of May, then you're pretty safe that it's no more frost after that.
Knapke: Well, my Mother's Day gift as when the kids were growing up is that I got to have the whole day in the garden on Mother's day.
Juravich: Exactly what you wanted, right? That's what I wanted. With no one talking to you? They can talk to me.
Knapke: May not get an answer. Right, right. Yeah.
Juravich: A whole day in the dirt.
Juravich: Thank you for having me. Thank you very much. Thank you, everyone. Have a great day. Thank you all. Bye.
Knapke: All day in the dirt.
Juravich: That's your idea of the perfect day, right?
Knapke: Mm-hmm.
Juravich: Well, a lot of people turned to gardening during COVID. They like wanted to return to the soil, embrace growing their own food, beautifying their yards. Everyone was at home more. Do you think there's a lingering impact for that?
Do you have the number of people who seem interested in gardening stayed up or are people getting back into their gardening as an aside routines?
Knapke: I think it's a little of both, but I do notice that people want that beauty in their yards. And they also want, for me, I'm calm when I'm in my garden, unless I get stung by a yellow jacket. Oh dear. Yeah, I know.
But the garden is a calm place for me and it's where when the world becomes too much, It's a place to go and I think So many people discover that during COVID that that's kind of stayed. And maybe they don't have as much time now to do what they did during COVID, but there's still that desire to have a planter, one tomato plant, three tomato plants have a small garden and there's something about eating the food from your own garden that you cannot replace.
So I think that has stayed for many. Maybe not totally to the extent of COVID, but. Please, garden, it's the best way to take a deep breath.
Juravich: What about when the economy turns rocky and people worry about food prices? Do you think they turn to gardening as a food source? Or does it stay more of the hobby area?
Knapke: Um, I know that some folks are using it as a food source. There's been an uptick in foraging, although please be careful, know what you are picking so that you don't accidentally pick the wrong thing.
There is an uptake in food gardening in, in our industry. They talk about where different, um, plants, groups of plants, where they're being sold, how, uh, how many are being sold. And it is amazing how many food plants are showing up on the lists, herbs too, lots of herbs.
People are getting into the idea of, oh, I think I'll use lavender to balance myself out and go out and pet the lavender in the garden. But again, it's turning to being self-sufficiency.
We see sometimes that things can get rocky, and they have been rocky, and self-sufficiency helps us with that. Also, smelling a rose, to me, brightens my day. Yeah, take the time to smell the rose.
Juravich: There's a reason that's a phrase, right? That's right.
Juravich: Well, on that list that you mentioned, whenever you say that there's more food listed on the list of popular plants, is it just tomatoes and green beans and green peppers or anything unusual? It is a lot of the usual, but people are putting
Knapke: food shrubs in their garden?
Juravich: Oh, like what? Like berries?
Knapke: Well, raspberries, blackberries, you know, technically those are shrubs, but also some shrubs like the chokeberries.
Juravich: Okay, I've heard of those, but I can't I can I am not sure I've eaten one
Knapke: If you've eaten one, they're pretty astringent. Usually you get them in jam, or you get them, I had chokeberry wine that was delightful.
Juravich: Okay, I think I've had jam maybe from a farmer's market. Okay, so tell me more about chokeberries.
Knapke: They are superb wildlife plants. The flowers are super supportive of our generalist bees and insects and the berries are great for birds and other animals who forage and for us if we get there before the birds do.
Juravich: You have a great, you have a gr-
Knapke: turn a phrase. I love that generalist bees. Well, we also have generalist bees like our Bumbles. They'll take pollen and nectar from just about anywhere. Most of them will. But we have some native bees that are specialists.
There's an Adrina species. There's a group of Adrina bees that only go to goldenrods, period. So if you don't have any Goldenrods in your garden, you don't support this bee. Do we know
Juravich: I know I need to support the bees. Bees are not my favorite. Of the things in the world. But I don't think I have any golden rod, so I don't have that be.
Knapke: And you don't have to do everything. Maybe your neighbor has it. Yeah. It's, we don't have to do it all. I think we keep hearing, you have to do this, you have to do that. Pick what most excites you and do that growing food, supporting wildlife, et cetera.
But if you do it all, you'll drive yourself crazy. Besides the choke bear.
Juravich: I interrupt, you were gonna list off something else. Was there something else on the list?
Knapke: Besides, well, there's strawberries, but that's a creepy crawler. Now, of course, nothing is coming elderberries, elderberry, again, elderberry wine. Funny how.
Juravich: I'm thinking jam you're thinking
Knapke: time. Yeah, there you go. Sorry about that. We brew and ferment just about everything, don't we? And of course, my list of fruit shrubs are just disappearing from my brain.
Juravich: Well, ponder the shrubs while I talk about drinks and dirt. Celebrate Cinco de Mayo with fellow 89.7 NPR news listeners at our Drinks and Dirt event hosted by WOSU Public Media.
Deb Knapke will be joining us for a relaxed, hands-on evening, stenciling pottery, enjoying refreshments and creating a succulent planter to take home. And we will be sure you know exactly how to take care of it when you leave.
It is May 5th from 6 to 8 p.m. So start a sustaining gift right now. $13 a month or a one-time contribution of $156 at wosu.org. Get your seat to this event right now before we run out of room.
And you're going to get to take home a planter so you can remember your fun night for months to come. Thanks to Groovy Plants Ranch for the help with the plants and thanks to Deb for being our guide today on the radio and at this event.
Get your ticket now, secure your seat at wosu.org. If you listen to All Sides every day, then you know that this show is committed to producing in-depth. Focused conversations on issues important to Columbus and central Ohio.
You hear from our Weekly Reporter Roundtable every Monday. You hear straight from newsmakers from all sides of the aisle. If having a locally focused talk show is important to you, now is the time to make a gift and support the station.
Give now at wosu.org or call us 866-897-9678. And this is a great time to support the station because remember, we have limited number of seats to our Drinks and Dirt event, so don't wait. You can learn more about the event at wosu.org as you make your gift.
We want to see you on May 5th, so make that gift now before the hour ends. And thanks to Richard Jones from Orient. And Richard says, good to hear the Garden Sage back. She has answered so many questions for me over the years.
So you have a fan, Richard. Thank you, Rich. And this is 89.7 NPR News. We are talking to Ohio's garden sage, Deb Knapke. She is joining us for our membership drive. She's joining us for our drinks and dirt event.
Give now a wosu.org. What types of decisions do we need to be making right now for our gardens, for planning, for that fun Mother's Day weekend we're gonna have out in the yard?
Knapke: Well, of course you're going to go to plant stores, your favorite plant nurseries, but if you are planning to plant a garden, you might start by putting a layer of compost down in your garden. Although, I'm just thinking of how cold we've been.
Only put it about two inches, otherwise you're keeping too much cold in the ground. Some people might also be just cultivating their soil gently. I am not fond of doing a big rototilling, kind of. Although some people rototill their annual vegetable gardens every year, I like the garden to settle and to get a good microbial community built up.
So I very seldom do a lot of digging other than to plant my plants. But buy your compost and Start weeding, the weeds are already here and the ones that don't have seeds, leave those in the garden to go back into it.
The ones that do have seeds put them in your bad compost pile or, or do what you do, uh, hopefully your, your subdivision or your area has composting. And then the most important thing is planning. What kind of seeds are you going to plant in your garden?
There is a really superb, um, publication. From Extension called the "Ohio Gardening Calendar." Okay. And it has all kinds, I didn't bring a paper copy with me, but I brought an electronic copy. And it tells you month by month what you can be doing with seeds.
So if you love to work with seeds inside and out, this is a great handout.
Juravich: So if you want so some seeds you probably need to be planting inside right now because it would yeah, right? Yeah, get things started like your tomatoes
Knapke: Probably you put in about three weeks ago, right, everyone? Of course, yes, yes. And your cucumbers a week or a couple weeks ago. But some plants are great vegetables for seeding directly into the soil.
Others are better if you start them and then transplant. It all depends on what you want to grow, perennials, annuals. Marigolds. You can start now inside and then plant them out and mother's day.
Juravich: I'm on like a couple discussion forums on social media and there is this whole debate going back and forth of like because the weather has been so topsy turvy about whether you should be like cleaning things up or if you are like gonna end up killing a lot of insects because you cleaned up too early and the insects need that to live in because it was gonna get cold again.
So I don't clean up. You never clean up, okay.
Knapke: I do in the fall, if there's too many leaves in a garden, I like a good cushion of about two inches of leaves that come down, I leave them there. I may fluff them a bit, but for the most part, I leave then be, and I leave the be in the spring.
If it's more than three inches, I will take some leaves out and I have paths in my backyard where extra leaves go.
Juravich: So you're not you're, not sticking them in a long waist bag should be taken away all right
Knapke: No. All my energy stays in my garden. You have to come to the garden, you'll see. And I have some areas between trees that I got tired of lugging all the leaves to my backyard.
So now I have a front yard path and I have the backyard path where all my extra leaves go. And it'll be about three feet tall in the fall and by spring, it's down to about, oh, eight to 12 inches. Okay. So what's living in there?
All kinds of them. And I can dig in there with my hands. It's black gold. Oh, man. It's wonderful. All kinds. You can see the threads of fungi. You can be beetles. You can sleep in bumbles. It is truly amazing what's underneath the leaves.
So I usually don't mess with them, but every once in a while, I'm curious.
Juravich: I can see you being curious and just sticking your hand in there and being like, gently looking to see if anybody's home.
Knapke: Yes, hello!
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. This is our membership drive, and this is a very special hour for 89. 7 NPR news in All Sides. You could celebrate Cinco de Mayo with fellow 89. Seven NPR New listeners at a drinks and dirt event hosted by WOSU.
Deb Knapke is going to join us for a hands-on evening. We'll be stenciling pottery, enjoying refreshments, and creating a succulent planter to take home. The event is May 5th from six to eight. Make a sustaining gift right now. $13 a month secures your seat, or a one-time gift of $156.
That gift gets you a seat at the table for this Drinks and Dirt event. But that gift also supports locally-focused programming, like this show that focuses on issues important to Columbus and central Ohio.
So make your gift right before we run out of room and before we ran out of time in this hour. Thank you to Stephanie Pulleman from Delaware. Thank you, Stephanie, for your gift of support. Join us now before the hour ends.
You are running out of time to secure your seat to drinks and dirt. It's May 5th, it has a Cinco de Mayo theme and you can join us at six o'clock at the WOSU headquarters. Again, $13 a month or a one-time gift of $156. 866-897-9678 or wosu.org.
I wanted to, we've done a couple of shows on this and there's just a lot of talk right now about native versus non-native plants.
Speaker 4: Right?
Juravich: And April is also native plant month in Ohio. What are some examples of your, do you have favorite native plants?
Knapke: I have so many favorite plants, you know, the trite saying whatever is in bloom is my favorite plant, but I do have some deep, deep favorites, especially the spring ephemerals, trilliums and the beautiful bloodroot.
The bloodroot has this amazing leaf. So the flowers, not the only part of it, but bloodroot, the flowers open for three days. That's how much time the flower gives. A native bee or a little fly time to pollinate it, then it closes up and pollinates itself if it's not found, you know, impatient plant.
And I mean just these life stories of these plants and then the, it's now in Primula, but the shooting stars upside down, flowers, just incredible. So spring ephemerals and also our spring shrubs. One of my favorite shrubs is Spicebush.
Spicebush is coming into bloom now. Let's see, what time is it? Yeah, it should be just about to burst into little yellow flowers that go into incredible berries that the birds love and an absolutely gorgeous fall color and it tolerates shade and black walnuts.
So we look at native plants, we see how they've grown together, how they evolved and we create communities. Which is what I love to do with native plants. I also bring in non-native plants because most of my herbs and my food plants are non-native.
But the native plants hold special places in my heart and especially in the back, I've kind of let it go and said, this is your place. So I manage it, I edit it, I take out plants that I don't want there in hopes that the native plans will just continue to take over.
Juravich: Where do you land in this whole native versus non-native debate? Like, do you encourage people to lean more native?
Knapke: I think it depends on what the garden is for, why they are gardening. Is it food? Is it to support wildlife? If it's supporting wildlife, it must be native. Must be native plants. If it is food, there are non-natives.
But there is also, I'm a horticulturist and the whole wide world has amazing plants and some of my favorites don't grow here. Like orchids and many of the succulents. I have a fondness for the snake plants and there are many, many species and they're fabulous.
But they're non-natives. They also are not invasive. So to me, I see there's a continuum of native growing here from here to non-native not growing here. And there are plants in between that have naturalized that came over here.
And we think they're native, but they're not. Mmm, like the crabapple? Oh, people say that, you know, Johnny Appleseed, right? Didn't he do that? He did, but yeah, they're native by way of Kazakhstan.
So to me, it is more important to think about what will work well together, what will build community, what will not take over, which means no invasive plants, please.
Juravich: So when you're thinking non-native plant, it's non-native, non-invasive.
Knapke: Yes. Non-invasive. Invasive plants are a huge no. Unfortunately, we're not always sure which plants will become invasive that cause environmental and economic harm and is almost impossible to get rid of.
Juravich: When you are talking about the native plants attracting wildlife, right? We're talking like butterflies, bees, and birds when you say wildlife. You're not talking like we're attracting like deer and we want raccoons or something. Well, we are inadvertently.
Knapke: It they do come yeah yeah we have several woodchucks or groundhogs in our backyard they're all named clover because they clover that is there one of their main foods and so I have a lot of clover in my lawn and most of the time that is sufficient for them if it isn't they go in my garden
Juravich: What about, is it getting easier to find native plants at gardening stores or nurseries, like in finding knowledgeable staff? So if you walk up to a certain gardening stores, maybe no, but some of them, I mean, if you walk up and you say, I want natives, they'll be able to help you.
Knapke: Most, especially in the independent garden centers. Some of the big box stores do not have as much expertise in that area. And please, I am not knocking them because they serve a niche.
But at the independent gardens centers, we pride ourselves on being able to answer your questions. That is what we can do. And you're seeing more and more natives as we become sensitive to... This is what we must do in our gardens.
Juravich: We have just about 13 minutes left in the hour, and we need to hear from 10 more people. We want 10 more to join us at the Drinks and Dirt event before this hour wraps up. We want to fill all these seats.
Thank you to Karen Kinlin from Pataskala. Karen, thank you so much for your membership and joining us on 89.7 NPR News. So now we need hear from nine more before the end of the hour. So Karen is starting us off here on a little mini goal.
We can make this hour a great success, but then we also will make Drinks and Dirts a great successful. It's a fun way to support WOSU Public Media and enjoy a unique night out. Drinks and Dirt with Deb Knapke and she is joining us on Cinco de Mayo for a Southwest themed evening of creativity.
Design your own planter and take it home. The succulents are locally sourced from Groovy Plants Ranch. Join us on May 5th from six to eight. Start a monthly gift for $13 a month to get your seat. You can make a one-time gift of $156.
If you're already a member right now, consider making a one-time additional gift. You will be supporting this station. And it's a great way to show that you've been listening in recent weeks and months and you find the news and information important right now.
But hearing this, it's, it a little kind of like extra vote for what's been going on in the world. The news is relentless. Things are changing by the minute. And if you depend on NPR and WOSU to keep you up to date.
And to explain things with context, especially recently. This might be a great time to make an additional gift and you can get a great thank you gift in return. You'll be spending the evening in a room full of public media people.
These are public media who also love gardening. Is that your vibe? Then join us for Drinks and Dirt on May 5th. And as a regular listener to All Sides, you know that we are gonna bring you a diverse range of topics, from a show about gardening to the Reporter Roundtable to Tech Tuesday.
We also have our weekly feature called Fascinating Ohio, where we introduce you to people from the Buckeye State with an interesting story to tell. If you appreciate this kind of show, make a gift at wosu.org, or call us 866-897-9678.
We're still looking for nine more people. We have 11 minutes left in the hour. We can meet this goal when we hear from you, and then we'll say hi to you in person whenever we have this event on May 5th. So join us. 866-897-9678 or wosu.org.
I wanted to talk about the spotted lanternfly for a minute.
Speaker 5: Oh boy.
Juravich: I know. I mean, it might not be a favorite topic, but it's a topic, certainly. So since February, all 88 counties in Ohio are under a statewide quarantine to combat the spread of the invasive spotted lantern fly.
They haven't been in Ohio all that long, about five or six years. But April is the month whenever they begin to hatch. So describe, I guess, what they look like, what their egg masses look like and what we're supposed to do if we see them.
Knapke: So I'd like to direct everyone to go to the Ohio Department of Agriculture, put spotted lanternfly ODA in your search engine, and you'll come up with a great sheet of facts and pictures of the spotted lanternfly and the egg masses.
Because the egg mass is, it looks like somebody took putty and just spread it on a tree, and it may have little lines in it. And you'll look at that and you'll think... That's not putty. That's spotted lantern fly. Ew. Egg cases.
So you want to scrape that off and put it in a bucket of soapy water or.
Juravich: We want to stop the eggs from happening.
Knapke: We want to stop the eggs from hatching, and we're running out of time for that, because we get another spate of warm weather, and those babies are going to be out. Go outside right now and get them.
Go look at your trees, because it starts with the individual, too. You know, that's one more mass of spotted lanternflies that don't get out.
Juravich: So if we miss them though and we see them flying around are we still in the we need to stomp on them when we see them yes always stomp
Knapke: In fact, that's the best way to do it. What you'll see are little tiny black bugs with white spots on them. There are four instars, four changes of how they look. And they get bigger with more spots and black, and then they start getting red on them to the point where the last instar, they sort of have a red spotted pattern, red blotches, white spots, on a black background.
And then the fly itself, if I didn't dislike it so much, is actually quite attractive. But you want to get the little ones. They move fast, but you know, you just take a nice big swipe and they squish easily. I just picture that in your mind.
I did that in New Jersey. They were all over in my son's backyard and I just went on a rampage. It felt, I don't know. Was it cathartic? It was cathartics. And I just looked at it and thought, you are not going to Ohio.
And then we looked at our car to make sure we weren't bringing any back. See if they hitched a ride with you. Because they will do that. Well, why are they so bad? What are they going to do? Well, fortunately, the good news, bad news.
Bad news is, the Good news is they like tree of heaven and that's what they feed on. They suck from the bark, from the stems, branches, et cetera. They suck the juices out. Is a tree of Heaven a tree we need to?
Juravich: It's an invasive tree. That's what I thought. I'm like, is it a tree we need to care about? No, so that's good.
Knapke: Yeah, and people have been removing them in in in trying to keep down the population Unfortunately, so it has a pretty name, but it's not a good tree. Okay, not really heavenly Okay
The bad news is is if there aren't any tree of heavens spotted lantern flies second most Wonderful food source is grape vines Mmm, so up in Northeast, Ohio
Juravich: That's a shame.
Knapke: And in southern Ohio where we have all our wineries, we do not want this pest. And then if that's not there, they have about a hundred other trees, I think it's a hundred, that they'll go and eat from.
So they like to woody plants specifically, but then they'll to others. So we need to stop them. And if you hear like urgency in my
Juravich: There is. I want to say thank you to Mary Napoli. Eight more to go this hour. Mary Napoli is from Columbus. Thank you for your gift. We have just about six or seven minutes left to go.
And Mary wrote that she's thrilled to hear Deb on the air today, so hi to Mary. Thank you, Mary. And we want to hear from you. So right now, make a gift. Eight more go in the next six minutes, and we can. Fill up the room for drinks and dirt.
We can make this hour a great success and you'll be supporting public radio. Don't wait, you are running out of time to make your gift. The hour is almost over. Ohio's Garden Sage Deb Knapke joins us for an evening of Drinks and Dirt with WOSU Public Media.
Our event is on May 5th. We'll celebrate Cinco de Mayo with a Southwest theme, stencil your own terracotta pot, enjoy some refreshments and take part in a live Q&A. And then you'll create a succulent planter to take home. The event is happening from six to eight.
It'll be at WOSU's headquarters. Make a gift of $13 a month right now or give a one-time gift of 156 dollars to secure your seat. Make that gift at wosu.org. We will have plants that have been sourced by central Ohio's own Groovy Plants Ranch and Ohio's garden sage will be joining us for the evening.
If you listen to All Sides often, then you know we work hard to bring you a diverse range of topics from news of the day to long-term trends. You're going to hear it all in this show. Our goal over time is to bring you all sides of the issues that matter to you.
And if this is something that you enjoy hearing, remember that this is something that happens only on public radio. Support local programming that is truly local. And remember that you have to give right now to get your spot for our special Drinks and Dirt event.
We have a limited number of seats. Don't wait, give now. And that gift supports public radio, it's a great win-win today. Make this drive a success, make our Drinks & Dirt event a success. Give it double osu.org or call 866-897-9678.
I wanted to take, we're running out of time, obviously I said that numerous times, but I wanted talk about the importance of soil health. Do you recommend people getting their soil tested? Do they need to know if anything's wrong?
Knapke: If you haven't had your soil tested and it's a new garden, it's always a good idea to see what you have, how much organic matter, how much nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, et cetera. In our clay soils, the nutrients get locked up.
And so for me, compost is the answer. And then nutrient cycling, leaving your leaves and, um, other materials that fall in your garden. Soil health is our foundation. And it is so important, just so important.
To have good soil health, to support plants, to support wildlife, and to support us. Because that's how it goes.
Juravich: Where can you go to get your soil tested or what can you do?
Knapke: You can buy soil test kits from Extension, so depending on the county you are in. Some counties may do soil testing, but I believe we send our soil tests here in Franklin County to either Penn State or Purdue, their soil testing services.
And then you get a little packet, tells you how to do it, then you send it out, then you get your information back. And it's kind of fun to find out what's under the ground. So much is happening. She's all smushed.
Juravich: She's all smiley about this, yeah. Soil testing is cool, soil is cool. I wanna say thank you to Gail Falkenberg from Columbus. Thank you Gail. So seven more gifts to go to meet our little mini goal for this hour.
We have about three and a half minutes remaining in the hour. Join us for our Drinks and Dirt event with WOSU and Ohio's Garden Sage, Deb Knapke. I will be there. I will take part in a live Q&A with Deb and we will chit chat about all of your gardening questions.
You're going to stencil your own terracotta pot. You're gonna enjoy some refreshments and then you're gonna create a succulent planter to take home and the planter will feature plants from Groovy Plants Ranch. This is all happening on May 5th at six o'clock.
Make a gift of $13 a month right now or a one-time gift of 156 dollars and you can join us. Just like Laura Partridge did from Columbus. Thank you, Laura. So six more to go. We can meet this goal when you give today and your gift supports public radio.
If you listen to All Sides every day, we're asking you to support the programs that you value. You listen to 89.7 NPR News because you know you're going to hear news that you trust. We're asking to make a gift of support, make this drive a success and support your future listening.
Supporting public media each month as a sustaining member is a great way to stand up with pride for informed, connected community news. It's a choice to keep this service strong and independent. Make your gift today at wosu.org.
Well, we have been talking this hour with Ohio's Garden Sage Deb Knapke. Thank you so much for your time today. It's been a joy to be here. And we will see you again on May 5th, and we hope to see you at this event as well.
So there's still time for you. Join us. This hour of All Sides has been all about gardening and it's a favorite topic of All Sides listeners. So thank you for joining us on our membership drive today.
This is a very special hour because of our very special thank you gift. Spend an evening getting your hands a little dirty. Deb Knapke will join us for Drinks and Dirt at WOSU's headquarters. You'll stencil a terracotta pot.
You'll enjoy a Southwest inspired atmosphere and you'll build your own succulent planner to take home. Again, this is May 5th from six to eight p.m. And make a monthly gift of $13 or make a one-time contribution of $156 to secure your ticket right now.
Public radio is for the lifelong learner, people who chase their curiosity. And we take that learning piece to the next level by offering a hands-on class that will be fun and educational. And you can join us.
You'll be attending this class with a great group of public radio supporters. So make a gift now, secure your ticket and support public radio. And I should add of course that this class will include refreshments that compliment our Southwest theme.
Secure your seat right now. Thank you to Beth Montgomery from Reynoldsburg. Thank you so much. And she says to us to keep up the great work. We will do it. Oh, it's Betty Montgomery. I'm sorry.
Thank you, Betty Montgomery! For making your gift of support. We want you to join Betty and join us for this class. This is listener supported WOSU FM and HD1 Columbus. We're online at wosu.org. And we want you join us at this event.
Again, one last time. It is May 5th at six o'clock at WOSU, Drinks and Dirt. Make a gift of $13 a month or a one-time gift of 156 dollars. Secure your seat right now. Make a gifted 866. 897-9678 or go to wosu.org. Thanks for listening today and thanks for your support.