The city’s women’s volleyball team, Columbus Fury, has new owners.
Married entrepreneurs Andrea Mitchell and Andy Sandler acquired100% of the team from the previous ownership group, which included Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow and his parents.
This comes at a time when The Greater Columbus Sports Commission is putting a greater emphasis on women’s sports, including trying to get a women’s soccer team in the city.
Women’s sports are on the rise with increased viewership of the women’s bracket in March Madness and more focus on women in the recent Winter Olympics.
Guests:
- Andrea Mitchell, owner, Columbus Fury
- Linda Logan, CEO/president, Greater Columbus Sports Commission
- Dunja Antunovic, associate professor, sports sociology, University of Minnesota
Transcript
This transcript is generated with AI. To ensure its accuracy, review the audio file.
Amy Juravich: Welcome to All Sides with Amy Juravich. Women's sports are having a moment, a long awaited and some would say long overdue moment. There's been more attention paid to female athletes in the recent Winter Olympics and the NCAA March Madness brackets are giving women their due.
Here in Columbus, the city is leaning into this momentum with recently announced Ignite Her campaign with a goal of making Columbus the nation's capital for women's sports. A part of that equation includes attracting a professional women's soccer team to the city. And we'll talk more about that push a little later in the hour.
But first, we'll about the professional women team that's already here. Columbus's pro-volleyball team, the Columbus Fury. The team recently announced new ownership. Joining us now is one of the new owners, Andrea Mitchell. She's the founder of a majority women-owned and women-managed law firm based in Washington, D.C. And she has purchased the team along with her husband, Andy Sandler. Welcome to All Sides, Andrea Mitchell.
Andrea Mitchell: Thank you, great to be here.
Juravich: I guess we'll start with the obvious question. Why did you purchase the Fury?
Mitchell: So many reasons, as you may know, Andy Sandler, my husband, his passion is baseball. And so he owns three minor league baseball teams and is part of the ownership team that bought the Tampa Rays. So when your name gets out there as an owner and operator, you get a lot of investment opportunities in all sorts of sports in different leagues.
So what we were very intentional in deciding that the next team that we bought would be in women's sports. It was something obviously a passion of mine. I was an NCAA athlete. And we just think that we need to infuse more capital into this burgeoning area of sports. And we're very excited about it.
Once we started to look at women's sports, we talked to a lot of different leagues and we were introduced to the major league volleyball last year, and it was just a natural fit. I mean, for so many reasons, there's a great pipeline in the U.S., right? Just so many young women wanting to, and girls wanting to play volleyball. It's a more popular sport than the men, which is not often when you get into professional sports that the women's sport is more popular than the man's. And it's just a really healthy, vibrant league and we're excited to collaborate with the other owners.
Juravich: Did you play volleyball or do you have a passion for volleyball or are you gonna learn volleyball as an owner?
Mitchell: I'm learning as I go. Yeah, I mean, obviously I watched the Olympics. I watched NCAA sports. I went to the University of Wisconsin where it's a very successful team there. So I always cheer my Badgers. But no, I think it's more just about infusing a lot of energy and all the resources and talent we can into any league that we think has the prospect for success and we very much think MLB.
Juravich: Is that Lee. So you purchased the team from a well-known Ohio family. Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow owned the team along with his parents Jimmy and Robin. Did you approach them with an offer or was the team already for sale?
Mitchell: The team was already for sale. And so we actually didn't even know the connection until we were kind of deep into the process. So our dealings were really with the league and the league's front office. So I would very much love to meet them. I know that they are a staple of central Ohio community. So we very much appreciate the opportunity to pick up this team and know that they are central to that community there.
Juravich: Are you disclosing the price you paid? Cause I couldn't find that figure anywhere.
Mitchell: I can't either. I'll be honest. And I negotiated the deal. It's very complicated because what is extremely rare about this deal is, is you don't normally see a change in ownership midseason. And that's, there's a reason for that is the economics get very difficult to break down in the middle of a season. So while we appreciate the opportunity to do it, it is super complicated and I couldn't tell you a number even if I had a
Juravich: All right. Well, I'll let you keep the number for secret for now, but maybe someday. All right, so you live in Virginia. You have another home in Florida. You went to Wisconsin. You just said your firm is in Washington, D.C. Do you have a Columbus or Ohio connection at all?
Mitchell: I don't have a Columbus connection, but I have deep ties to the Midwest, right? I was born and raised in Illinois. My kids have a lot of family in Indiana. I obviously went to Wisconsin. I have a lotta family in Wisconsin. So it just, it felt right.
I mean, there were probably a lot of other franchises or expansion areas where we could have considered, but when Columbus came up, it was a real draw for me to be in the Midwest in general. And of course, it's another Big Ten school, so always a fan of promoting Big Ten communities.
Juravich: So I've been to a few Fury games and listeners, they're very fun by the way, if you haven't been. And at each of the games I was at, I don't know if this is always, but each of games I at, Jimmy and Robin Burrow were there. They were sitting in the front row. I think Joe Burrow, the quarterback, has only made it to a a few games. But I guess you would call them, Jimmy and Robyn, on the ground owners. Do you plan to be an on the ground owner coming to a lot of games? I guess I'll say this.
Mitchell: As much as is appropriate, right? Now, I know my place in the sense that I will be their biggest cheerleader. I will do everything I can to ensure the safety and health and wellbeing of our players, positioning our coaches to do everything they can to create a positive culture for our players and our fans.
And so that's really my goal. And if that means sitting courtside, I will happily sit courtside and be their bigger cheerleader, but I also know that, I'm gonna leave the coaching to the coaches and just be their big fans.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News.
We're talking about women's sports with the new owner of Columbus's professional volleyball team, the Columbus Fury. So full disclosure, I'm a huge volleyball fan. I played in high school, you know. But not a lot of people are. Not a lot people know as much about volleyball as they do about soccer or basketball for women, for example. So do you have any plans of getting more people to know more about volleyball and get more people to the games?
Mitchell: Absolutely. I mean, when I think about what my initial goals are for the Fury and frankly for the league is doing everything we can to get the word out. And because I have to say, since people have found out I became the owner, people come from everywhere, all walks of life of people I know. My daughter plays, my niece played, I played, you know, I played division three, I played Division one.
Um, it is really, uh, and it's such a draw too, but, you know, we shouldn't just watch it around the Olympics, right? Or the NCAA tournament. I think it's, it's a great game to watch any, any time in any environment. And I, I do think that one of the things that is making it somewhat inaccessible that I plan to focus on too, is that it costs money, right.
I mean, when I was growing up, if you wanted to play a sport, you just showed up, right, and you went to the gym and you played, I think now with the emphasis on clubs and trainers and, you know, with special private coaching. I don't want people in America to think I can't play volleyball because I can afford it. So I would love for not just us to focus on pros or even college, but just let's make all sports accessible to girls.
Juravich: So Major League Volleyball has eight teams in the league. And unfortunately, if you look at the standings, the Fury are in last place. What can you do as the owner to improve the team's prospects in the future?
Mitchell: Yeah, it's, you know, I use this phrase, crawl, walk, run, right? So we're not, you now, chances are we're gonna make the playoffs next year, but what we like to do is to just build a strong foundation. That's true of any franchise, any company, any organization is you gotta start with that culture, your values, what your values are, and then making sure you surround yourself with people that will be good ambassadors of your culture and your values.
And then people will come, right? I started my law firm back in 2019, and we had a couple of people and a few laptops, right. And now we are, I think, one of the more successful financial services firms in the country, at least in the boutique size firms. And we attracted that talent, not because we had to go out and tell everybody we're the best. It's just like when you create an environment that makes people want to be there and not just be there, but stay there. It's a winning model and so we're going to just replicate that model here and we're going to provide the best environment we can for people and then I think people will come and then.
Juravich: We will be champions. All right, well talk to me about ticket prices because I interviewed team captain Megan Lush last year and she was hesitant about talk of dropping ticket prices to get more fans into the arena because she said you know they're professional athletes they're trying to make a living wage they want to be professional athletes so you can't just give away tickets for free but what are your thoughts on the ticket prices versus getting more Yeah, to butts in seats.
Mitchell: I think what it is, is to try, I mean, for me, it's less about thinking about individual sales, but it is or, you know, upping the ticket prices because I care deeply about being able to afford a family experience or an experience for a group of friends without, you know saying, oh, you can't afford it, I can't go, right, we want everybody to have access to that.
And so I think less about the ticket sales and more about we want people to come back again and again, right? And they get the like the mini season ticket packet or they get a season packet. Um, they do group sales. I would love for our corporate friends and partners to start bringing their, um, their events to our place and have a game. So that's really how I think about it is, is less about the, you know, trying to get, you, you now every last dollar out of people and more about making sure people come back again and again.
Juravich: What about the venue? In that same interview with Megan Lush, she said she loves playing at Nationwide Arena. Good vibes and high ceilings, which she loved. But the venue has to be very expensive too. Have you thought about the venue for this volleyball team?
Mitchell: A lot, we've thought. A lot about it. And we talked a lot too, you know, and frankly, we're going to end up working with Columbus Arena Management pretty much no matter where we go. But that's a blessing, I would say. They have been tremendous partners to us, Columbus Arena management, and of course they manage nationwide.
And they've been very cooperative with us, really welcoming and supportive of our effort and appreciative of the challenges that we have because it is so big and because it's on ice, right? There's a lot of extra challenges there, but it is a fantastic facility. And once we decided we wanted to stay at Nationwide for the time being, it's been full steam ahead.
They're great. They're super invested in our success and as we are in theirs. And we're happy to be there. And yeah, it a little big, but you know, we would like to have the problem some day of selling out Nationwide. We're not there yet, but in the meantime, I think our players enjoy it, just like Megan was mentioning. And so we're we're to be happy to there.
Juravich: And we'll be there next season. Okay, so the next season, but you're not, you're saying that maybe, you know, two, three seasons down the road, there might be a different venue discussed? I'm not sure there is one that's.
Mitchell: Jumps out at us. Again, having explored this pretty thoroughly, what I'd like to think is on the realm of the possible in the short-term horizon, and Mayor Gunter has talked about this, is that he wants this to be the, you know, women's sports capital of the nation, which we would too.
So there may be room at some point for a new arena that is right-sized for this kind of crowd and this kind, of sport, not just for us, but maybe women's ball and other kinds of women's sports. I have my eye on that. It's not in the very near term, but that's really kind of what I can see happening down the road.
Juravich: So the Fury are third place in the league when it comes to average attendance. So I think the average attendance last year was something between 4,000 and 5,000, and nationwide holds almost 20,000. So yeah, but you were third in the League in attendance. So what do you make of that with like, is Columbus growing? Do they love the sports? And can you get the 4,00 up to more consistently higher numbers?
Mitchell: Yes, yes, and yes. I think Columbus is just a great community. They're very loyal to all their sports teams, Blue Jackets crew, you name it. So we appreciate their loyalty and whether you're winning or not. And although there's certainly gonna be more enthusiasm when we start winning, but so that's great. And I think also we don't have a lot of competition. I mean, this is not Chicago. This is not Los Angeles. So I think that helps too.
Um, but, and, and then also it happens, Columbus happens to be, for those of you that I'm sure you know, this are big volleyball fans is it is very, a very volleyball center kind of area that central Ohio have a very competitive, um, club and Mittenet. And, uh, so that that's a draw and the way we just increase those numbers. It's so doable. I mean, it's so achievable, um, considering what they've already done.
And now that Andy and I are prepared to really put in a lot of, um, sweat equity into this and hiring people that help us. And by the way, we have a commissioner now, Jamie Weston, who's gonna be fantastic in expanding marketing outreach, broadcast, et cetera, is I just think we have nowhere to go but up. Yeah, it's not gonna be that hard because we have such a willing community and nearby residents who wanna celebrate it.
Juravich: What do you think of that focus that the city of Columbus you mentioned? They want the ignite her campaign. Um, the city wants the city to be the nation's capital for women's sports. Uh, what are your thoughts on that? I mean, obviously that's a good thing for you.
Mitchell: Perfect timing, yeah, perfect timing. It was right, I mean, it was announced literally right as we were kind of fully committed to buying the Fury. So again, the city's just tremendous in terms of being our partner and we're so appreciative of that, but it's time, right?
And I feel like a lot of local officials and other leaders are prepared to invest, but to be so intentional about it, right, with the initiative. And to have so many different facets because there are so many different kind of needs depending on whether we're talking about school-aged children or collegiate or professional. There's just so much opportunity and the enthusiasm is there, but to really harness it into a single initiative I think is brilliant and we're glad.
Juravich: To be a part of it. But does the city need to support the Fury more? Do you need more support, more promotion, more buzz about the team from the city? Because as an example, last year, the city gave the team about $500,000. The county gave $500000, which is great. That's no small sum of money. But they're talking about needing $25 million for this women's professional soccer team. So do you need More from the City?
Mitchell: Well, listen, we'll always take more with, if they're willing to give more. But what I wanna say is I appreciate that the city and the county expended political capital to create those grants for the current season. And we appreciate that. And we know there are a lot of ways that the City and County's dollars can be spent for the needy.
And so, we are prepared to put our money where our mouth is, Andy and I and others. And frankly, I would love to just see partnerships that just create awareness, visibility, support for what we're doing, whether that's grants or otherwise. I think it's really more just about getting the word out and helping us promote the team.
And then for me, in terms of the finances, it's more about making, there's just so much opportunity in private equity and venture capital. I think that we just need to get the word out that this is a league that's here to stay and we can get private funding in ways that we don't put a strain on the city and the county.
Juravich: Yeah, you want to lean more into private funding than asking the city for more money.
Mitchell: It seems fair. I mean, again, they did a lot to keep this team afloat in the last year, and we're so appreciative of that. So there may be times where we have needs that will come back to the city and county for an additional partnership, but in the meantime, we'll just take them, you know, elevating our brand, getting people to hopefully support the team in other ways.
And also, by the way, we've got some amazing corporations and businesses in Columbus. So to the extent the city is willing to create introductions to create some of the, again, some of that... Sponsorship and other partnerships. We would very much welcome the opportunity to have introductions from the city and county for companies that have their home in Columbus and-
Juravich: We've been talking with the new owner of Columbus's professional women's volleyball team, the Columbus Fury, Andrea Mitchell. Thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you. And coming up, we're gonna talk about the city's push to attract a professional women soccer team to Columbus. That is when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich.
Efforts by the city to get a professional women's soccer team to Columbus are evolving. There's talk of a public-private partnership with money from the Haslam Sports Group, plus money from city and the county. Also, a tax on crew tickets has been floated. Meanwhile, the city's professional women volleyball team, Columbus Fury, has a new owner. And this all comes at a time when the city, and the state, and the country, for that matter, are all putting more focus on women's sports. Joining us now is Linda Logan, CEO and President of the Greater Columbus Sports Commission. Linda, thanks for joining us.
Linda Logan: Happy to be here.
Juravich: So let's start with this push to get a professional women's soccer team to Columbus. Why has this become such a top priority for the city?
Logan: Well, it's an exciting time for our community and women's sports. You said that right off the top. And we want to stack hands and add to our already growing women's sport scene. Historically, we have some great programs with our college and, of course, the fury coming into town. But we do feel like this is the time. We have these great soccer facilities in the city. We have good ownership that wants to stack cans with the public and private partners. And it's our time.
Juravich: So to get the team to Columbus, do you know what other cities you're competing against? I mean, is it a competition?
Logan: It is a competition. It's our understanding there's four or five other cities that we know of. It's unofficial, of course, but I know that Cleveland, St. Louis, Las Vegas have all expressed interest in many different ways, but unofficially those are what I'm hearing.
Juravich: So it takes money to bring the team here and you have to promise to have what the team needs if they arrive. So such as a practice facility and changes need to be made to the current stadium to accommodate a new team. And the way the city will get that money is an evolving conversation right now.
So the Haslam Sports Group, which is the owner of the Browns and the crew have promised some money, but there's also a need for an investment from the city and the county. And what do you think is the best way forward money-wise? You just mentioned that public-private partnership, but it seems like some money from the city might be a no-go right now.
Logan: You know, I'm hearing really positive things. Of course, these are complicated issues, but I think Columbus is known for our ways of the Columbus way of, you know, all working together, stacking hands. There's a lot of priorities out there in the community, not only in Columbus, Franklin County, Ohio, but throughout the country.
But I do think if we're thinking of this as a generational project, imagine if we would have passed on getting the Columbus blue jackets to the city a couple of decades ago and not building nationwide arena. The arena district. I always equate it to that Christmas movie. "It's a wonderful life" that the community would be a lot different had we not done that. And at the time it was of course risky, but bold. And I think that's what's happening again. We're having this once in a generation project that we will look back on now and say that this was defining moment.
Juravich: Now, a lot of people, you're just hearing talk on social media. They just want the Haslam Sports Group to pay for it. They're billionaires. They have the money and they don't want to put city and county money into it. Can't will the Haslem Sports Group put up more money without the public part of that public private partnership?
Logan: I think that the league itself is wanting that public partner partnership because they're learning that that's what is the most successful over time. So I'm in Phoenix this week for the women's final four. We're hosting it next year. And I know that they've had some issues with keeping their NHL team here because and I don't know all the particulars, but I do know that for the league, so that's the best model that can last the test of time. So I do think. That these investments spread over multiple years will be a good thing for Columbus. Of course, in the seat I sit in, of course it would be a very exciting time.
Juravich: So at a city council meeting, it kind of seems like the 25 million from the city is a no-go. The budget is tight and they want to spend the funds on city services, not on the prospects of this team. So WOSU News talked to Council President Shannon Harden yesterday and he's proposing a ticket tax on crew tickets to raise the money. What are your thoughts on that?
Logan: I know that the ticket tax was passed a couple years ago and has proved to be very successful. We were one of the only cities in the country not to have one. So I do think that there's a lot of opportunity there. I don't have all the particulars, but I do know it has historically worked for us in the last few years.
Juravich: Okay, do you know if City Council President Shannon Hardin kind of went rogue in proposing this crew ticket tax? I mean, did he talk to, like, I guess maybe the Haslams need to be involved? I don't know who needs to be in this talk, or did he just float it out there to see what would happen?
Logan: I'm sure that Council President Harden, as all City Council, have worked very closely with the City Auditor, you know, all the people that are going to run those numbers that along with the Haslams, along with county, that's one of the best things about being part of this community is that people do work together here.
Juravich: Okay, so you weren't surprised when you heard, when you hear in the paper or on the radio or wherever you heard it, that there was maybe gonna be a crew ticket tax.
Logan: There's been a lot of options that have been talked about. So I know that's one avenue. I know there's a capital would be another option. So I that many different options are being considered.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News.
We're talking about the push to get a professional women's soccer team to Columbus with CEO and president of the Greater Columbus Sports Commission, Linda Logan. Earlier in the show, we just spoke with Andrea Mitchell, the new owner of the Columbus Fury. This is a professional woman's team that we already have, not a proposal, they're here. What are your thoughts on this change in ownership for the Fury?
Logan: We are so excited to welcome Andrea and Andrew to Columbus. I've had an opportunity to meet with her a couple of times now and couldn't be any happier for the vision that she has for the team. And it's just what we need at this moment in time.
I know that the league started just a couple years ago and we were one of the original franchise teams and volleyball is a huge sport in Ohio and especially in central Ohio. So it's that next progression for for us to have this professional team here. So it could be more excited to welcome them to Columbus.
Juravich: The Fury are a struggling team attendance wise and they're currently last place in the league. Do you have any concerns that the new owners might move the team, look for a city with a little more support for volleyball?
Logan: No, I do feel like they are committed to Columbus. They've seen how community efforts work here. And I know that that's not on their radar. And as far as our team goes, certainly the ebbs and flows of winning and losing make a difference, I think. But we have historically these first few years been in the top few with attendance, sponsorship. So now we just have to win. And I think we'll continue to see this franchise grow.
Juravich: Andrea Mitchell mentioned wanting more support from the city, not necessarily financially. She seems more inclined to try to get more private money for the money part, but she wanted more support for the city for promotion and just more emphasis and focus so that everyone in central Ohio knows that the Columbus Fury exists. What can the city do from your office to help with that?
Logan: Yeah, so I think when you say the city, I think she feels very comfortable with the city and the county and the support that they have played with our team. I think, she's probably thinking about community support and maybe that city term used broadly, and I don't wanna speak for her, but the Ohio Valley region of USA Volleyball, they are the second largest region in the country with over 30,000 people playing volleyball, organized volleyball and not just central Ohio, but around the state.
We typically have 7 to 10... Tournaments in Columbus, and I know we're working very hard to make those dates match up so that the Fury and the OVR are in the city at the same time. So I know there are some great efforts underway. So I do think that this is just that moment in time of a new league that people are learning about, and it's going to just go up from here.
Juravich: I want to talk about the Ignite Her initiative. This is the push by the city to make Columbus the national women's sports capital. What made the mayor's office and your office, I guess for that matter, decide to make this push?
Logan: Columbus has traditionally been a great city for girls and women in sports. We are, in the Greater Columbus Sports Commission, we have really made that part of our work is to attract some of the finest and the best sporting events in the country for girls, and women, and sports.
So as evidenced by 2027, we'll be hosting the Women's Final Four, the women's volleyball championships. So we come by it honestly. We have over a thousand college athletes competing in Franklin County alone each and every week. Depending on their season. So I would say that we come by it honestly, but that the mayor and Shannon, they're both recognized with their own daughter how participating in girls sports has made a difference for their family.
And with the emphasis that they've done with the Columbus Women's Commission, it's just been a great partnership. I think how it happened was when the mayor and his family went to the women's final four in 2018, their daughter, Clara. Was eight years old, was not really interested in sports, and because of that she started playing basketball when we hosted the volleyball championships in 21. She decided to play volleyball as well, and now she's in high school traveling the country playing volleyball with club sports and high school sports. So in their own daughter, they saw her grow and all the things that we learn through sports has impacted their family, and that's how this partnership came together.
Juravich: Well, Cleveland won the dance in the women's sports department because they will have a WNBA team coming up here in a couple of years. So why not have it be Ohio is the women sports capital instead of just Columbus? I mean, are you competing against Cleveland? You said you are, I guess, for the soccer team. So, yeah.
Logan: I think in our industry, we're friendly competitors. So there are six or seven cities that now are really putting a stake in the ground for girls and women in sports. And I think that's fantastic. The more the merrier, right? Where all these glass ceilings are breaking all over the country. So I view it as a partnership.
So even though it may seem that we're just talking about Columbus because that's our role here, but we work arm in arm. I was with the folks from Indianapolis last night. We're just taking about how we can work together with them as well. So. So we are working together and I think it's a special club that all these cities want to raise the bar and raise us through that glass ceiling for women in sports. So there's enough room for all of us.
Juravich: I want to pivot back to Columbus getting a women's soccer team for a minute. I've seen a lot on social media about signing a petition to get the team here. Do you need names on a list to attract a team? Tell me about this petition.
Logan: Sure, I think for Columbus and I think our effort again to make things stand out and how can we put Columbus in the forefront is trying to do that grassroots effort of making sure that we are putting our best foot forward. It takes more than just the ownership team. You want to start this grassroots efforts of showing support and show excitement.
So for one thing, it's the petition. I think there's a lot of things happening behind the scenes where we're talking to all the high school coaches. Not only in central Ohio, but throughout Ohio and trying to gain support. So it's just one other, I guess, feather in our cap, if you will, to show support. And it's exciting to see the effort.
Juravich: What about this practice facility? Cause that seems to be the crux of what the money is needed for. You need to build this practice. Do you need to have the facility in order to get the team or do you need to just have the promise of the facility? Like what, what do we need to do to have this practice facility in relationship to actually getting the team?
Logan: For many years, women's sports were treated not as equally as some of the men's sports. So again, this is showing that equity, gender equity and giving, looking at what would make this league and this team the best it can be. And that does start with the training facilities where the teams play.
Of course, we have Scott's Miracle Grove Stadium, one of the best in the country. I worked in Kansas City for 10 years before I came to Columbus. And although I've been here a long time, I get back there quite often. And to see what that women's soccer team has meant to that community. And that's a huge football city. As you know, the Chiefs have won a couple of Super Bowls in these last few years.
But when you go to Kansas City, everything is teal because, whether it's on the busses and because they were the very first city to build a practice facility and a stadium just for women's sports. The first in the world, I might add. So it's very young in the effort, but the league is starting to expect this from the new teams. And rightly so because It's been generations of not having that equity in sport for women and now is the time. So I do think it's important.
Juravich: So how long will this campaign be? I mean, does the professional women's soccer league, do they have a date when they're going to decide which team gets?
Logan: It's our understanding that there'll be a decision this month in April, so all of the great efforts that are underway right now are to be able to bring this home to Columbus.
Juravich: Oh, wow. So this month, so we need to get our ducks in a row here. So yeah. So what do you want to do with the money? I mean, do you wanna see them approve probably in the next week or so? Do you want to see them improve this crew tax or the city come up with the money or the Haslam's put more money like what's going to happen?
Logan: So we all wanna stack hands and do what's best for Columbus and we'll do it the Columbus way. So I know there's so many things happening behind the scenes and stay tuned, right? So we'll know shortly, but I do think everyone's best intentions are happening right now.
Juravich: Okay. So what about this petition? Do I need to hurry up and sign it? I had no idea. Absolutely. We were, I had, no idea we were on such a deadline. Okay.
Logan: We definitely are. So send it to all your family and friends and to all your listeners. Again, it's just one one other way that we show our support for getting this team to Columbus.
Juravich: All right, well, related to women's sports, you mentioned why you're in Phoenix. Columbus will host the 2027 NCAA Women's Final Four at Nationwide Arena. The games are scheduled for April, a year from now. So you're Phoenix to learn about what to do, I guess. So what does the city need to know? What do you need to do to prepare for next year?
Logan: Well, the event has changed so much, you would think because we're a season host in 2018, but the event is grown so much. So there's 18 of us here from Columbus looking at the convention center, all these ancillary events, what has changed, the branding, all the things that we did very, very well, by the way, in Columbus in 2018. But the event it's grown by leaps and bounds.
So we're not resting on our laurels. We're here to learn. And it's an exciting time to be from Columbus to be hosting. We're on the clock and for instance, when we hosted the event in 2018, there were probably about six or ten ancillary events that were hosted on or around it. Last year in Tampa, there was 98. That's just how much has grown since we hosted. And so we're here to learn that as well and just exciting times to be a women's for its fans.
Juravich: Yeah, so I guess that just proves what you're saying about 2018 versus right now, just proves the growth of women's sports, not just in Columbus or the state of Ohio, but nationally. How do you feel? Do you feel women's Sports are finally getting their long overdue, do or are we still climbing up the hill here?
Logan: I think we're growing. I think they're headed in the right direction. There's so much enthusiasm. And just even being here in Phoenix this week, and I only got here yesterday, of course, but just the excitement of the branding and just knowing that so many more eyeballs are on the sport right now, it's pretty cool.
Juravich: Well, I wanna thank you so much for your time. We've been talking about women's sports in Columbus and the potential of getting a women's soccer team here with the CEO and president of the Greater Columbus Sports Commission, Linda Logan. Thank you for your today, Linda. Thanks, Amy.
Logan: Sign that petition.
Juravich: I will, I will. Coming up, we are talking about the growth of women's sports nationally. That is when All Sides continues on 89.7 NPR News.
You're listening to All Sides. I'm your host, Amy Juravich. Women's sports are having a moment, a long awaited and some would say long overdue moment. There's been more attention paid to female athletes in the recent Winter Olympics and the NCAA March Madness brackets are giving women their due.
Here in Columbus, the city is leaning into this momentum with the recently announced Ignite Her campaign with a goal of making Columbus the nation's capital for women's sports. To talk about the growth of women's sports, we have an associate professor of sports sociology at the School of Kinesiology at the University of Minnesota, Dunja Antunovic. Welcome to the show.
Dunja Antunovic: Thank you for having me.
Juravich: Um, so do you agree with what I said in the introduction? Are women's sports having a moment? Um, is there truly more attention being paid now than in the past?
Antunovic: Yes, definitely. And it's a very extended moment. I would say that perhaps it started in the mid-2010s when we started seeing a little bit more attention on women's sports and all the industry reports continue to tell us that women's sport are a great investment, that women sports are continuing to grow, viewership is expanding.
There is a kind of a strong business case for women's The only part that I would add is Minneapolis is actually also trying to be the number one city for women's sports, so I think Columbus might have some competition there.
Juravich: All right, yeah, yeah. I think, okay, so this phrase, becoming the nation's capital for women's sports, Columbus didn't invent that, is that what you mean?
Antunovic: Well, I think it's friendly competition. And certainly, if we see more investment in women's sports in different cities, that can only help the women's leagues grow and the nationwide attention continue to be there.
Juravich: What about those who say this is long overdue? How does the momentum continue? What needs to happen?
Antunovic: Yeah, so there is a few things that need to happen. You know, we certainly have seen attempts at creating women's sports leagues in the past. This is not new and sometimes the success is there. Sometimes these leagues fold, but right now, what we're seeing is kind of continuous expansion across different sports. One of the aspects I study is how local media are responding to the growth of women's sport. And so I think continued attention from media organizations is one of the key ways to sustain this momentum.
Juravich: Yeah, I was, you've been doing this research in how the media in like local markets cover professional women's sports. So is that, does that mean like in the sports segments on local TV news, for example, do we hear women's sport scores or do they show highlights? Is that what you mean when you say local coverage?
Antunovic: Yes, exactly. And some of the longitudinal studies have shown that local newspapers dedicate really very small percentages of coverage to women's sports. The percentages are a little bit higher in smaller markets. But in local television, we've seen kind of 5% of coverage in a local news segment, in the sports segment.
But I think that's changing. And obviously we also have a lot of media organizations that are dedicated specifically to women's sports. I think the greatest challenge for local media are that while women's ports are expanding, the staff and resources are shrinking. And so one of the things we are trying to figure out in our research is how can that relationship function better and how can women's sport teams provide the information that journalists needs. While journalists are operating under these very, very tight resources.
Juravich: So maybe you're saying that the sports team needs to send highlight reels to the local TV station if they don't have the staff to come cover all these different sports. Is that what you mean?
Antunovic: Absolutely. And that's already happening. So in our studies, when we're talking to journalists, they're saying that the fact that women's sports leagues and teams are now able to secure broadcast rights, and that means we can see women's sport on TV still with some limitations, but the games are likely to be there.
That really allows local TV stations to bring in those highlights and make sure that they have coverage of women's ports for their viewers. And so again, this is kind of a cycle that if women's sports coverage is available in one area, then other media can draw on it and certainly increase their coverage as well, even with the limited resources.
Juravich: Fans showing up to games. Have you looked, have you done any or looked at any research about attendance of women's sports events?
Antunovic: Yeah, so there's a lot of attendance numbers that we see, and we constantly see kind of that women's sports teams are breaking records. That's particularly important for new teams. And then sometimes that attendance number drops off a little bit once the team is established. A lot of it is going to obviously depend on whether the teams are winning.
But I think local commissions and local communities are really trying to also tell stories beyond the teams winning to ensure that the audience support is there. Uh, one thing we know from our research at the university of Minnesota that some of my students are doing is that, uh, fans of women's sports are still having a hard time finding games, uh on television. And so, uh getting that media access to, to sustain that fandom is going to be
Juravich: very important. Here in Columbus, we have a professional women's volleyball team, the Columbus Fury. They play at Nationwide Arena, which is a big venue. It's where our hockey team plays. So they don't fill it. But I do hear that volleyball is more popular in other cities. There's a team in Omaha, Nebraska, for example, that has sellout crowds. An attendance record at Omaha was set at more than 16,000 fans. So how does Columbus build a volleyball community?
Antunovic: Yes, that's a great question. And I think some of your local folks would know this better. But you mentioned Nebraska. And obviously, Nebraska is a powerhouse when it comes to women's volleyball. And they're clearly building on that. And I Think it's really important that cities can develop their own identities around women's sports, right?
And so if Columbus decides that they want to be the women's-volleyball city, I think a lot of it begins also with kind of grassroot support of growing players, potentially obviously support for college volleyball. And so I think it's about telling a good story.
Here in Minnesota, there is tremendous attention on girls and women's hockey. And so Minnesota is, for example, really leaning into that identity that Minnesota is the state of hockey. And so they're able to generate the kind of attention to women's hokey that perhaps we might not see elsewhere. So I think there's a potential for cities to kind of tell their own stories and really build an environment on that, it takes a lot of different forces to make sure that the attention is there.
Juravich: You're listening to All Sides on 89.7 NPR News.
We're talking about women's sports with associate professor of sports sociology from the University of Minnesota, Dunja Antunovic. I think that women's soccer and women's basketball have more of a following, but that's also because there's men's teams that came before them. So for volleyball, for an example, women are starting this thing. There's no men's professional volleyball teams. What do you think about women building this volleyball franchise.
Antunovic: You know, I think that's a really interesting question. And I would add also that perhaps one of the reasons why women's soccer and women's basketball are so successful in the US is because the national team, national team has had very strong success at the Olympics, at obviously World Cups and so forth.
And it's really interesting to see women's volleyball in the U.S. Because as you mentioned, you know, in other countries, men's volleyball is also very popular. And here perhaps there is an opportunity to really of leaning into the importance of women's volleyball in the U.S. Obviously, college volleyball has been tremendously successful for several years and now we're seeing those attendance numbers also grow and so I think building on the energy around college women's volleyball is going to be a key component of professional women's volleyball.
Juravich: Success. Well, since you're in Minnesota, I have to add hockey in there because I think women's hockey is certainly having a moment, especially after the most recent Winter Olympics. So do you think that we're we're in a place where the the professional women's Hockey League can can make a push here to be as popular as soccer in the WNBA?
Antunovic: I think for women's hockey, you know, a big change happened with this, with PWHL, because the previous leagues, you knew, there were multiple attempts to create a sustainable league and the PWH is working very well. That's my understanding. They're expanding to markets. Obviously, some Canadian cities are very important in women's Hockey.
Um, so I think maybe women's hockey will, uh, stay, uh quite, uh contained to specific markets. And the question for leagues is going to be how, why do they expand, right? While also making sure that they do have the pipeline, the talent, the resources to sustain these leagues financially. And so, um, I think that's going to be a question for all the leagues. Obviously the WNBA is expanding still the NWSL is expanding. We might see that happen in women's volleyball and women's hockey as well.
Juravich: Columbus recently launched a campaign to try to attract a professional women's soccer team to our city. What do you make of a push like that? Is it good for a city? It'll be hard, I guess, if Columbus loses the bid after putting so much effort into this. So what do you of these pushes for cities to try and win a team?
Antunovic: Yes, I mean, I think it's happening, right? And what to me that reflects is that women's sports are a part of the city's portfolio to enhance tourism, to maybe in some cases revitalize certain neighborhoods or create kind of restaurants and so forth. So that's the narrative that I've seen also from other cities.
In terms of soccer, my understanding is that Columbus does have a men's soccer team, right? And so the question is, are we going to see the same audiences show up to the women's soccer matches who are showing up for men's football, right, so are you going to see soccer fans show up, or is the women team going to have their own audience?
Based on the data, industry data where we have about other teams is sometimes those two are not the same audience, right? The audience for the NBA team might not be the same as the audience for the WNBA team. So for your local commission, I think kind of really understanding the local community and their needs and who is going to be showing up to women's soccer is going to be really important for all women's sports.
Juravich: No matter where it is, do we need people in person watching the games or do we need them on TV? Like what, what, what is the goal here to expand women's sports and make these professional athletes get paid, you know, like the men do? Do we, so do we more TV or do need people in the seats in the stadiums?
Antunovic: Probably all of it. I asked this question when I talk to journalists who are covering women's sports. And I tell them, well, clearly the attendance is there. Are you seeing this attention reflected in the viewership? And it's interesting because journalists typically have two approaches. One of the approaches is to say, well we need the audience to be there and the fans to show up and the teams to do well in order to cover them.
And then there is also some journalists to say. Okay, but it is our responsibility to cover the team and to create content so that the audience knows where to go for it. And so I think the viewership and media attention is a little bit separate perhaps from attendance and fandom, but certainly both of it needs to happen. A lot of the way the women's professional sports work is that a lot depends on those eyeballs, right? And metrics and so forth. And those are very much driving decisions.
Juravich: Have you done any research into the pay of professional athletes, whether women are getting closer to being paid at a professional level?
Antunovic: I have not. I have there's some economist colleagues who are much better prepared to do that work But you know, there's big differences depending on the league and team and obviously there's a lot of conversations right now, but the WNBA is Collective bargaining agreement. And so I think that really depends on the structure of the league in the team how they are navigating that
Juravich: And what do you think of this year's March Madness? Have we seen a turning point? Because I feel like anecdotally, there's more attention on the women's bracket than ever before this year. Is that true or am I just thinking it?
Antunovic: Well, this is my first time doing the bracket, and I'm not doing well, let me tell you. Yeah, I think those things like the availability of a bracket and for fans to be able to engage with women's sports in these kind of extra ways in addition to just watching, I think all of that matters, right? Like how is the tournament also promoted outside of the time when the actual broadcast of the games happens, right.
I think what we've seen in the past is, even if there was coverage of March Madness and the women's NCAA tournament, it was really just like, okay, here is the game, right? Good luck. But for fans to be able to engage, and I know a lot of women's sports bars are kind of a big thing as well in cities that are generating a lot attention for women's sport. So for bars to create those kind of community events where fans can come together and really kind of create excitement around it, I think that's really helping as well.
Juravich: This is the first year I ever filled out a women's March Madness bracket, in addition to the men's brackets I've done for years, which I guess is on me that I'd never done it before, but it was, it was offered to me by the website. And so I did, um, I'm not doing well. I, uh, poor Ohio state didn't make it as far as I thought they would. Um, just as a final question, we have less than a minute left. Um, where, what do you think, where do we go from here? What is, what are you think is the, is the next step with women's sports? Do we just need more people paying attention?
Antunovic: Well, my focus is really on recommendations to journalists and to women's sports teams. And I think as these new teams kind of established themselves, it's really important that they invest in their communications and PR staff. One of the things that I'm hearing from journalists is that women's sport teams do want the attention and a lot of times it's fairly easy to work with them, but sometimes they are running into some serious barriers.
You know, they have told me like, oh, I couldn't get access. And so I didn't have a story about the team for three days. And then the audiences think that we don't care about women's sports, right? And so, I think establishing that relationship between new women's sport teams and the journalists who are covering them is going to be one of the ways in which women's ports can continue to be sustainable.
Juravich: We've been talking about the growth of women's sports with Associate Professor of Sports Sociology at the University of Minnesota, Dunja Antunovic. Thank you so much for your time today, Dunya. Thank you for having me. And thank you for joining us. This has been All Sides on 89.7 NPR News. I'm Amy Juravich.